The return of Christ personality

[Sena]

Paul, thanks for your excellent summary of "who or what Seth is or was". You mention the return of the Christ personality. A reader of this forum who is not that familiar with the Seth books may confuse this with the Christian distortion which says that Christ will come again to "judge the living and the dead". Seth explicitly stated that this not the case:

The third personality...has not in your terms yet appeared, although his existence has been prophecied as the "Second Coming". Now these prophecies were given in terms of the current culture at that time, and therefore, while the stage has been set, the distortions are deplorable, for this Christ will not come at the end of your world as the prophecies have been maintaining.
He will not come to reward the righteous and send evildoers to eternal doom. He will, however, begin a new religious drama. A certain historical continuity will be maintained. As happened once before, however, he will not be generally known for who he is. There will be no glorious proclamations to which the whole world will bow. He will return to straighten out Christianity, which will be in a shambles at the time of his arrival, and to set up a new system of thought when the world is sorely in need of one.
By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis. He will undermine religious organisations – not unite them. His message will be that of the individual in relation to All That Is. He will clearly state methods by which each individual can attain a state of intimate contact with his own entity, the entity being to some extent man's mediator with All That Is.
By 2075, all of this will be already accomplished.


...The third personality of Christ will indeed be known as a great psychic, for it is he that will teach humanity to use those inner senses that alone make true spirituality possible. Slayers and victims will change roles as reincarnational memories rise to the surface of consciousness. Through the development of these abilities, the sacredness of all life will be intimately recognised and appreciated.

[Sena]

Deb, I would be very happy for you to start a new topic on the future coming of Christ. This is where I found the quote (from "Seth Speaks"):
http://www.thenewgnosis.org/thesethiangnosisoldandnew.htm#Seth_on_the_%E2%80%9CSecond_Coming%E2%80%9D

[BethAnne]

future coming of Christ.
Do you think this personality will be a woman?  Maybe a film director?  Maybe the Matrix itself?

[Deb]

Conversation moved from here:

the Christ personality

Although I'm the least religious person I know, the concept of the Christ Personality is very interesting to me in the Seth books. Maybe because of what I'd been taught in my childhood about the Christ, and Seth was finally explaining who and what this man was and why he's still such a hot topic. I'm looking forward to learning more about him, just as I want to more about who Seth is/was.

But I have to leave for now. This will give me plenty to think about today.

Update: I felt the need to add some quotes about the return of the Christ personality for background, explanation and reference purposes. The following are from Seth Speaks, Session 560:

(9:46) Your Christ figure represents, symbolically, your idea of God and his relationships. There were three separate individuals whose history blended, and they became known collectively as Christ—hence many discrepancies in you records. These were all males because of that time in your development, you would not have accepted a female counterpart.

These three individuals were part of one entity.... These three figures worked out a drama, highly symbolic, propelled by concentrated energy of force.

The events as they are recorded, however, did not occur in history. The crucifixion of Christ was a psychic, but not a physical event...

(9:55)

Each of the twelve represented qualities of personality that belong to one individual, and Christ as you know him, represented the inner self. The twelve, therefore, plus Christ as you know him (the one figure composed of the three) represented an individual early personality—the inner self—and twelve main characteristics connected with the egotistical self. As Christ was surrounded by the disciples, so the inner self is surrounded by these physically oriented characteristics, each drawn toward daily reality on the one hand, and yet orbiting the inner self...

The three Christ personalities were born upon your planet and indeed became flesh among you. None of these was crucified. The twelve disciples were materializations from the energies of these three personalities—their combined energies.

2nd coming: session 586

(9:10) The historical Jesus knew who he was, but he also knew that he was one of three personalities composing one entity. To a large extent, he shared the memory of the other two.

The third personality, mentioned many times by me, has not in your terms yet appeared, although his existence has been prophesied as the "Second Coming" (Matthew 24). Now these prophecies were given in in terms of the current culture at that time, and therefore, while the stage has been set, the distortions are deplorable, for this Christ will not come at the end of  your world as the prophecies have been maintaining.

(9:20) He will not come to reward the righteous and send evildoers to eternal doom. He will, however, begin a new religious drama. A certain historical continuity will be maintained. As happened once before, however, he will not be generally known for who he is. There will be no glorious proclamation to which the whole world will bow. He will return to straighten out Christianity, which will be in shambles at the time of his arrival, and to set up a new system of thought when the world is sorely in need of one.

(9:25) By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis. He will undermine religious organizations—not unite them. His message will be of that of the individual in relation to All That Is. He will clearly state methods by which each individual can attain a state of intimate contact with his own entity; the entity to some extent being man's mediator with All That Is.

By 2075, all of this will be already accomplished...

the third personality of Christ will indeed be known as a great psychic, for it is he who will teach humanity to use those inner senses that lone make true spirituality possible...

Now there will be several born before that time who in various ways will rearouse man's expectations. One such man has already been born in India, in a small province near Calcutta, but his ministry will seem to remain comparatively local for his lifetime.

Another will be born in Africa, a black man whose main work will be done in Indonesia. The expectations were set long ago in your terms and will be fed by new prophets until the third personality of Christ does indeed emerge.

From Rob's notes at 9:37: There were three men whose lives became confused as the life of Christ... Each was highly gifted psychically, knew of his role, and accepted it willingly. The three men were a part of one entity, gaining physical existence in one time. They were not born on the same date, however. There are reasons why the entity did not return as one person. For one thing, the full consciousness of an entity would be too strong for one physical vehicle. For another, the entity wanted a more diversified environment than could otherwise be provided.

("The entity was born as John the Baptist, and then he was born in two other forms. One of these contained the personality that most stores of Christ refer to... I will tell you the other personality at a later time.")

9:57 The third historical personage, already born in your terms, and a portion of the entire Christ personality, took upon himself the role of a zealot....

The man, historically now, was Paul or Saul. It was given to him to set up a framework. But it was to be a framework of ideas, not of regulations; of men, not of groups. Here he fell down, and he will return as the third personality, just mentioned, in your future....

When the third personality reemerges historically, however, he will not be called the old Paul, but will carry within him the characteristics of all three personalities.

[Goes on to describe advances in humanity with the second coming...]

11:20 For several reasons, as mentioned by Rubert, I do not want to give any more detailed information as to the name that will be used, or the land of birth.

[voidypaul]

     Hi Beth,
               the new Christ will be male . This society is not sufficiently advanced enuf to accept a woman , sad but true .  He will be a poor man, naturally , he is not here for the rich + famous except to kick their asses back into human gear. What on earth do you mean by Him being the matrix itself ? 


   Hi Deb,
          ''Although I'm the least religious person I know ''


   Yes i can understand your dislike of the run of the mill religions but do you understand the inner religiosity of the self ?


   I can hear you pulling at your hair + screetching , what the fck does he mean , this is a Seth site .  But my dear this inner religiosity exists in Seth himself + even Seth 2 hahahhahahahahahahahaha , i bet thats gonna fck with your mind but I'm going to be cruel + leave you to dwell on it for a while as i also asked this question of LenKop + i  want to hear his reply before i answer y'all + actually seeing that i have posed the question what do any of you think of my most far reaching statement hahahahehehehehehhohohohoho ? 


the not so peaceful + stirring the pot , paul

[Deb]

I can hear you pulling at your hair + screetching , what the fck does he mean , this is a Seth site .

Au contraire (to quote the late but great George Carlin), stir the pot Paul as much as you can! And I'm not so much a reactionist as I am a considerer of others' viewpoints. I've sometimes been accused of not having much conviction. Maybe so. I prefer to think I'm open-minded. I'll consider anything, and keep or reject whatever feels right or wrong to my inner self.

My definition or relationship with the word religion is as limited as my gut reaction to the word "god" -- tainted by a lifetime of followers of organized religions trying to force their belief systems on me. I WILL dwell on what you set forth with the phrase "inner religiosity." (Please excuse the uniquely American use of quotation marks with punctuation.) I've been long-told that I'm a spiritual person, which to me means anything outside of (and sometimes, rarely in my experience, including) organized religion.

From Merriam-Webster:

Simple Definition of religion
      : the belief in a god or in a group of gods
      : an organized system of beliefs, ceremonies, and rules used to worship a god or a group of gods
      : an interest, a belief, or an activity that is very important to a person or group


It's the organized/group thing that bothers me.  They both smack of OLC to me.   
      
So, I'm looking forward to more of an explanation. I'll dream on this tonight. And I'll let you know how that goes.

[BethAnne]

I'm an extremely positive person who has had to factor in the "negative" to balance out my child like naivete.  I tended to view life through Rose Colored Glasses which put me into some dangerous situations.  There isn't a "devil or evil" in Christian Science.  As I get older my life has taken on a Fairy Tale quality which amazes the shit out of me sometimes it is so bizarre.  These "negative topics" on this larger scale have only really been in my face lately.  If anything, I have "curiosity killed the cat" syndrome.      The Theme lately seems to be about balancing Polarities which means "evil" has been in my face to deal with.  To transmute.  Transcend.  Transform.  My "job" seems to find that Sweet Spot of Perfect Balance. 
I'd be surprised if a Returning Christ would not be a woman.  Or more likely be The Sophia.  The lack of the Divine Feminine is exactly why the planet politics is unbalanced and is in need of a woman's touch. 

As to the Matrix.  With our Mass Communications the Christ Consciousness could be portrayed in a movie with effectiveness as a real person.  It's a concept that needs to be addressed rather than a person per se.  Who would really believe if a Christ returned?

[BethAnne]

[BethAnne]

Fairy tales are inextricably linked to the work of Carl Jung. The "collective unconscious" that lies at the core of his work, and which he believed is shared by all human beings, is revealed through archetypes, forms and symbols found in ample evidence in fairy tales. Some Jungians argue that one reason fairy tales appeal to children is that they are in a stage of their development only slightly removed from deeper layers of the collective unconscious. Jungian therapists study fairy tales to help analyze the dreams of their patients. Jung's disciples have gone on to interpret fairy tales as lives in miniature, suggesting, for example, that each character within a tale may represent an aspect of personality.
http://www.mccarter.org/education/secretinthewings/page16.htm

[Sena]

I'd be surprised if a Returning Christ would not be a woman.  Or more likely be The Sophia. 

Yes, I would be disappointed if it is not a woman. It would take a woman to shake up the old Pope and 2000 years of patriarchy.

[Wren]

Talking of women & Catholicism:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/16/pope-francis-is-a-master-at-playing-to-the-crowd-but-we-wont-get-female-deacons

[BethAnne]

Great find Wren!
Pope Francis seems like a nice guy, but in my humble non-Catholic Opinion I feel he is just a white wash to cover what the last guy did.
https://2012patriot.files.wordpress.com/2012/06/nazi-youth-pope-ratzinger.jpg

Any belief system that excludes the Feminine is out of balance.
I think the Gnostics had it for the most part with their belief of Sophia.  The Church made sure they were pushed out in the Council of Nicea.  Religion went from communing with God directly to having to go through the Church Priests for a price.

The First Council of Nicaea (/naɪˈsiːə/; Greek: Νίκαια [ˈni:kaɪja]) was a council of Christian bishops convened in Nicaea in Bithynia by the Roman Emperor Constantine I in AD 325. This first ecumenical council was the first effort to attain consensus in the church through an assembly representing all of Christendom,   One purpose of the council was to resolve disagreements arising from within the Church of Alexandria over the nature of the Son in his relationship to the Father: in particular, whether the Son had been 'begotten' by the Father from his own being, and therefore having no beginning, or else created out of nothing, and therefore having a beginning.[11] St. Alexander of Alexandria and Athanasius took the first position; the popular presbyter Arius, from whom the term Arianism comes, took the second. The council decided against the Arians overwhelmingly (of the estimated 250–318 attendees, all but two agreed to sign the creed and these two, along with Arius, were banished to Illyria).  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea

[Sena]

Talking of women & Catholicism:

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/16/pope-francis-is-a-master-at-playing-to-the-crowd-but-we-wont-get-female-deacons

Having male priests only is a fundamental principle of the R.C. Church. You might get married male priests 50 years from now, but a woman priest never. This is why I feel that Christ needs to return as a woman.

One possibility is that Jesus Christ was androgynous (both male and female):

http://cbmw.org/uncategorized/reconsidering-the-maleness-of-jesus/

That article concludes is this way:

McCready's conclusion is fitting: "Rejection or reformulation of the doctrine of [Christ] would eviscerate Christianity. The result would be nothing like that which has grown and spread for nearly two thousand years." He adds, "Every distinctive Christian belief would have to be discarded, from the doctrine of God and a realistic picture of human sinfulness to the ethical expectations and promise of divine grace. The modern attempt to make Christianity relevant by removing one of its more challenging teachings would end by making Christianity irrelevant and even destroying it."

This is the real problem with Christianity, that it considers every human being "sinful at heart" right from the moment of birth. And this is what Seth rejects.

The Gospel Matthew 19:12 may be relevant:
"For there are eunuchs who have been so from birth, and there are eunuchs who have been made eunuchs by men, and there are eunuchs who have made themselves eunuchs for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. Let the one who is able to receive this receive it."

[voidypaul]

     Hi Deb,
                George C always chose an apt turn of phrase .
                Always like the openess you display too Deb .

               Your definition of religion is i think pretty much the prevailing one of those  intelligent enough to question the current dogmas .

               Inner religiosity, which belongs inherently to the inner self or soul + i believe is inherent in all created beings,  be they phys' or not.   Even Seth 2  the non phys' non thought form entity who is the 'higher' self of our Seth , has his non thought non phys' 'form' of religion. Chortle .

               I think Merriam-Webster falls far short of a clear or even precise description of what religion really is, an entirely weak brew indeed   . Does'nt really get to the root of the matter does it.

               Why is the Christ personality returning to start a new religious drama ?  And if He is here to set straight or even trash the old religions then what is it that He will put in its place because its not going to be some sort of pseudo scientific claptrap either,  though i'm sure He will set the sciences straight too ,,, it may be quite sethian in some ways, but it will still be religious .
               If its a religious thing He's going to reintroduce then what is it that religion actually is?  if its going to be soooo good for the world ?

               S'cuse my ignorance Deb but what is OLC ?

               Religion , hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm . Nice i think ,  i have been brought to my knees + laid waste on the ground in dumbfounded incredulity at a true turn of religious humility  ...,,,   one cannot but submit or sublimate ....,,,,  even Seth 2 sings praises + submits , even the pyramid gestalts , it is ineluctable  ,   one must transcend all boundaries, there are none who can resist , it is always greater than any one being or even collection of beings can bear  .......................

               Deb, its the reason why it is best for many to join together , as more (of it) may be attracted + each indiv' portion or self in the whole will benefit from the more massive result or connection , much more so than they could on their own . It is (a) mystery revealed by the will of the people .

               It obviously depends on the sincerity + intention of those who take part + True religion is inextricably linked to true faith hahahehehoho ,,,,,,,,,,,  not just beliefs , big  wink  . Comes a time when beliefs get left waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay behind , oooops . Where a suspension of beliefs is by far the better belief to adopt .

               Not the snotty stuff we have been offered by our so called churches but,,,,,,,,,

               True religion
               True faith
               Sethian
               

               peace , paul



    Hi Beth,

                we ll i've obviously got the wrong end of the stick then hav'nt i my dear , my apologies .
                People have different ways they feel they can balance out the different portions of the self(s) they are  of course, +  i respect your chosen differentiation's  that help you  see things more clearly from your present point of view ,  i think it's an interesting take on your personality actually Beth , bravo . I live + learn of course.
               
               I think those people that will come to know the Christ will perceive that the Divine Feminine is easily apparent in Him Beth. 

                        Beth;       
                               ''As to the Matrix.  With our Mass Communications the Christ Consciousness could be portrayed in a movie with effectiveness as a real person.  It's a concept that needs to be addressed rather than a person per se.  Who would really believe if a Christ returned?''


               I have to disagree with you on the movie thing Beth , no picture or movie could ever portray with any effectiveness who + what you really are,   let alone the Christ + His Divine personality , not  possible really .
               Those who will  know the Christ Beth ,  will come to know + understand who or what He really is . I hope i am one of them . I don't think He will make His phys' form known to many but i would imagine that He will at times dive into the mass reality of the human race + make mass contact from 'there' + for sure the masses will be aware of Him. It is a part of the religious thing  + something that movies would flail in helplessness to duplicate, haha . Regardless of futuristic holograms or whatever they could'nt touch a fragment of the real thing , not at all . Why ?  I'm sure you can deduce that one Beth .


                       Beth;
                             ''Fairy tales are inextricably linked to the work of Carl Jung etc , etc .''



               Fairy tales from Jung eh Beth .

               The mass uncons' or collective uncons' is of course a reality + contains infinite fairy tales, not just the one's that may be associated with an individuals personal uncons' as with Jung , but the true mass reality of faeries (which are real beings that live between the worlds) + the tales too , that these little faeries tell about us, haha .         Jung took humanity closer to the true uncons' but he did not fully percieve the true inf' reality that lies there, just a minute part he put his name to , hehe.
               He knows more now of course , but then , now he is closer to the 'center' of the truly expansive uncos' + perceives more clearly . Don't know if he has had to pass thru his ultimate bottleneck of cons' but i would hope his more expansive awareness has taken him beyond that anyway . titter .

               Psychoanalysis has yet to grow up Beth + this Christ will definately iron out much of the old bull associated with it . The  sciences will obviously take a bashing as well as the religions  + He will usher in a new age of understanding of the self both phys' + psychically . No mean feat of course but is all a part of this new religion thing Beth.
             

                                         THE NEW RELIGION

                                            of
                                                  Christ
                                                               simple is'nt it ?


   peace , paul

[voidypaul]

    Hi Sena , interesting chat to start up .

                    We have to go beyond all of the claptrap of the old religions without exception .
                    In spirit or soul or inner self we are all androgynous  (sexual divisions came long after the 1st humans) + the Christ will make this clear .
                    Glad you put in the rejection by Seth of the ''original sin'' rubbish as quite the contrary is the case of course , we are all blessed from birth + eternally .
                    The new religion of Christ will be just that , NEW .
                    He will be a He + not a Her but He will make it absolutely clear that these designations are superfluous to the true self which is both simultaneously .He will show how to be as one with past lives both male and female . Probably He will take some to the source of sexuality , which psychically , is union with the divine .

            peace , paul

[Deb]

Okay, for starters I had to go back into the section of Seth Speaks dealing with the Christ personality to gather some quotes, and then lost myself in the whole thing. I've distilled what I could down to a manageable size and placed it within my first post in this topic, if only to leave a breadcrumb trail for the uninitiated or those to come.

Why is the Christ personality returning to start a new religious drama ?

To fix things? Because we are asking for it? Because we're not progressing? Not meaning to sound trite, and no sarcasm intended, I think humanity has the propensity to move at a snail's pace and sometimes we need a brisk kick in the pants. Without handing answers to us on a silver platter, a new drama in order for us to work things out and redeem ourselves. Going back to the alien conspiracy theories: some (most) times we can't find our own way out of a paper bag, so aliens have to interfere every once in a while and hold our hands. And sometimes insert probes, lol. And with the description of the next coming, it could even be you. Except I'm not sure if you'll be around in 2075. I know I won't. At least not in this incarnation.

Deb, its the reason why it is best for many to join together , as more (of it) may be attracted + each indiv' portion or self in the whole will benefit from the more massive result or connection , much more so than they could on their own . It is (a) mystery revealed by the will of the people .

Yes @voidypaul , I wholeheartedly agree with the joining together aspect. One of my hopes when I started this forum: build it and they will come. I just wish we were all "more" and with less space between. The blessings of the internet I suppose, making the gaps smaller. I remember thinking when the internet became a "thing" that it was the cultural version of collective consciousness or The Field. I still feel that way.

Inner religiosity

Still working on internalizing "inner religiosity." Limitations of language and my own relationship with any word containing "religio" have created a small barrier for me. No worries, I'll work it through. For myself, I prefer to think in terms of spirituality rather than religiosity, where I consider spirituality as a reverence/respect for all of consciousness, without judgment or priority. No dogma at all but a way of living, loving, appreciating, respecting all that is (with lower case letters in this case).

               S'cuse my ignorance Deb but what is OLC ?

Sorry, Official Line of Consciousness. The version of reality agreed upon by humanity in order to maintain that seamless Mass Consciousness. The Box.

More to say about all of this soon. Getting ready for my Trip Of A Lifetime and my time is evaporating at an alarming rate. Not having as much time for the forum as I'd like.

Favor: I will bring one unread Seth book on my trip. Does anyone have a favorite to give me an idea what to bring? Beyond Seth Speaks, Mass Events, Seth Mat'ls? I have several unread books and am open to suggestions. If no suggestions, I will be left with the Eeeny, Meeny, Miney Mo method of selection. Not my preferred style, but with the Seth books I suppose I can't go wrong.

PS
@BethAnne the "aliens are taking me" meme was priceless!

[BethAnne]

    Psychoanalysis has yet to grow up Beth + this Christ will definately iron out much of the old bull associated with it . The  sciences will obviously take a bashing as well as the religions  + He will usher in a new age of understanding of the self both phys' + psychically .

So much good stuff to comment on.  I totally agree here.

we ll i've obviously got the wrong end of the stick then hav'nt i my dear , my apologies .
To have  a conversation  on such a deep concept only through type to someone across the world, without being able to hear one's inflection or see their micro expressions, I wonder how much gets lost in translation!??   On the internet I edit quite a bit and use a lot of metaphor and my sarcasm doesn't always come through!     Nothing to apologize for.
Because I've had so many alterations to the mechanics of my brain I have to be aware of what level I'm speaking from.   More than a few people have thought I was crazy!   But now after all this time things are starting to pan out the way I explained they would.

[BethAnne]

Il baked all day yesterday and found I kept ponding on this thread, which I feel is the most important issue on the forum.  We can collect all the information but how to apply it in our daily life and the issues the planet faces.  Issues are pushing to be examined and dealt with.  Historically, when society gets to this boiling point a Christ figure shows up.  There has always been a Messiah who is connected to the Winter Solstice, born of a virgin and risen with 12 disciples.  So on a very basic level we are talking about a "seasonal change".  Easter comes from the Goddess Eostre and burying  eggs in the fields for fertility.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/easter1.htm

It was a use of metaphor to say Christ will be in a movie....but I'm sure a Christ will use mass media.  How could he/she resist?     I'm guessing most of the misunderstanding over religion from people in my age (an age where people tend to be in charge...) comes from watching those great religious movies of the 50's.  How many people are subconsciously programmed to "see" Moses as Charlton Heston.?  Or Jeffery Hunter as Jesus in "The Greatest Story Ever Told"?

[BethAnne]

I lost a friend after I showed her this clip.  She just couldn't conceive of anything beyond her traditions.

[BethAnne]

The older I get the more I lean towards Gnostic thought, though I am still trying to wrap my head around it.  There may be a Christ figure but I believe "his" knowledge comes from the Sophia.

[BethAnne]

John Allegro was one of the original scholars who worked on the Dead Sea Scrolls......until he came out with his book.  He based his belief that Christ was a Sacred Mushroom after years of research.

"and when he had given thanks, he broke it and said, "This is my body, which is for you; do this in remembrance of me."
1 Corinthians 11:24
"Keep me as the apple of your eye; hide me in the shadow of your wings"  Psalms 17:8
"For thus saith the LORD of hosts; After the glory hath he sent me unto the nations which spoiled you: for he that toucheth you toucheth the apple of his eye."  Zachariah 2:8

Snake = Spine/Kundalini
Apple of my Eye= Pineal often represented as a pineapple which the Catholic Church uses as a symbol.
Forbidden fruit = hallucinogenic, soma, mushroom, ergot

Ergot, similar to LSD, may have been what triggered the Witch Trials in Salem
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergot

On a personal note, I've done mushrooms maybe four times but it has been quite awhile.  One experience explained it ALL. 

[BethAnne]

[BethAnne]

This is why I think we are expecting The Sophia.  The Christ is the Consort to the Divine Feminine.

Many, perhaps most, Pagan religions in the Mediterranean area had a major seasonal day of religious celebration at or following the Spring Equinox. Cybele, the Phrygian fertility goddess, had a consort, Attis, who was believed to have been born via a virgin birth. Attis was believed to have died and been resurrected each year during the period MAR-22 to MAR-25.

Gerald L. Berry, author of "Religions of the World," wrote:
"About 200 B.C. mystery cults began to appear in Rome just as they had earlier in Greece. Most notable was the Cybele cult centered on Vatican hill ...Associated with the Cybele cult was that of her lover, Attis (the older Tammuz, Osiris, Dionysus, or Orpheus under a new name). He was a god of ever-reviving vegetation. Born of a virgin, he died and was reborn annually. The festival began as a day of blood on Black Friday and culminated after three days in a day of rejoicing over the resurrection." 3

Many religious historians and liberal theologians believe that the death and resurrection legends were first associated with Attis, many centuries before the birth of Jesus. They were simply  grafted onto stories of Jesus' life in order to make Christian theology more acceptable to Pagans. Others suggest that many of the events in Jesus' life that were recorded in the gospels were lifted from the life of Krishna, the second person of the Hindu Trinity, or were taken from the life of Horus, an Egyptian god.
http://www.religioustolerance.org/easter1.htm

[voidypaul]

    Hi Deb ;

          I agree in large part with your initial comments but i think Seth said that this religious drama will more or less be completed by 2075 so it should begin some yrs before that .
          The whole point is , what do people think that Religion really is.
          Most folks don't even consider this but either slavishly give themselves up to the mainstream idea or if they have gone beyond the official religions , give it no further thought + see it as useless, as you sort of expressed in a previous post . Fair enough but the question still remains
                           WHAT IS TRUE RELIGION ?

         The joining together will be as you said , similar to

                    ''when the internet became a "thing" that it was the cultural version of collective consciousness or The Field.''

        but on a psychic level , + i'd imagine the Christ will have this ability , to delve into the collective uncons' + make contact from there .

        There is a difference between spirituality + religion in that even with spirituality one must have a connective principal between  all spiritualistic folks so that they can join together as ONE , + this is of course , RELIGION .
        Spirituality in + of itself has many different meanings to many diff' people but only True Religion has the unity that unites the differing forms . Which is in part why i say that it is the same (this true religion) for even Seth2 + the pyramid gestalts .

        Ahhh OLC , i see .

        peace , paul



   Hi Beth ;
           
            thank you for your understanding .

            Unfortunately again i will disagree somewhat , oopps .

            I'm pretty sure Christ will not use social or mass media to communicate His message . There will be no need to do so as He will be able to tap into the mass uncon' or mass cons' (whatever, its the same) so will not need the primitive forms of comm' we use today or will use in the future . In fact He will not want His phys' presence to be known to many for obvious reasons . Even though the Crucifixion was one of the main massive events in shaping humanity's history , i'm sure He will not want such a set of circumstances to arise again .

           I like the vids you post but they are pretty much superfluous to the Seth material or Christ . The gnostics sort of had it right but got caught up in the age old tradition of adding some sort of devil or dark force that we must fight with to regain control of our cons' .   Rubbish i'm afraid .
           If one takes just the positive aspect of gnosis , which is the searching inside of one's self for answers then yes i agree but the larger part can be dumped of course .

          Christ gets His knowledge from ATI + not some sophia, as nice a godess as she may be nor does He need some sort of a consort , He is the Christ , all is within Him , except ATI .   The older religions were simply that , older religions + cannot + do not supercede the Christ , they are all old hat to Him , He has been there before i assure you .

         And to imagine the Christ as some form of mushroom or whatever (as many as i have had) is just sheer pollyanna , but an entertaining concept .

          These hallucinogenic drugs most definitely have their use if used properly, but in our culture that is few + far between . They are after all just a springboard into other realms of reality + one must then try + emulate such exp' without them , hence yoga + meditation + Seth .

          I don't want you to think that i disagree or whatever with your ways of divining the truth as you do in your video forays Beth but it is best to remember that they are generally  only less than half truths + one must separate the chaff from the wheat so to spk after one has watched these things .

          When i said in my last post ,  ''Regardless of futuristic holograms or whatever, they could'nt touch a fragment of the real thing (Christ), not at all . Why ?  I'm sure you can deduce that one Beth .''   
         
          Were you able to do the deduction or come to any conclusion as to why no modern or futuristic forms of communication could equal the power + effectiveness of the Christ ?


          peace , paul
         

[BethAnne]

Oh Paul!  I came for the debate and knowledge.     I HATE when people tell me what they think I want to hear.
Peace to you also,
Beth

[voidypaul]

   Hi BethAnne ,
                        thought i would't leave you in suspense about what it is that will be so much more convincing about the Christ personality than any film or hologram could ever be + that is of course ,
that the information that He will impart will strike a chord WITHIN the hearts + souls of the race + not be something that particularly comes from an exterior source , totally different thing all together .
                       And all of these plaedians or whomever are also here to witness the re-emergence of this superlative personality as it is known by all of them that He is beyond even their own understanding + connectedness .

                   more peace , paul

[John Sorensen]

I could be wrong, but I feel its a mistake to wait around for any savior type personality to come and help us or solve our problems for us. Some groups have been waiting for over a thousand years for such figures, I have a hard enough time waiting for a bus.

It's the continuation of needing an external agent or authority figure to take the place of our parents.
Religious stories are nice, and often full of inspiration etc, but the growing up of humanity and continual expansion of perspectives of all that is through human beings is not dependent on such figures.

If anything, religious figures need us to tell their stories and dramatise them and reinterpret and reinvigorate them, otherwise they are just kind of boring individuals, without us mythologising them they are nothing.

So any Christ or similar figure has the power which we give it, or invest into it.

Consciousness being formless, shapeless and timeless has no need of vessels deemed more "special" than other vessels. Being everywhere at everytime then means that consciousness, or any stories told or reimagined, religious or otherwise means that Christ or other figures are eternal archetypes, who are updated every now and then by the storytellers.

Whether Osiris, Moses, Krishna etc, it's not a matter of who got there first, or who told which version of the story first, it's a matter of service, of consciousness taking on whatever attributes needed to better remind people of their own inherent divinity and stop giving away their power to idols of any sort.

[Deb]

the Christ personality

Can anyone explain to me why the "Christ" personality?
I know Seth talked about the Christ and how he was more than one being (three? too big a personality for one human to bear), but when I read about that all I could think was that Jane's religious background of Christianity (the holy trinity) was mucking up the non-biased communications of Seth. Why labeled Christ personality, where there were so many other larger-than-life religious icons than him? Was the Christ name used out of convenience and recognition?

I could be wrong, but I feel its a mistake to wait around for any savior type personality to come and help us or solve our problems for us. Some groups have been waiting for over a thousand years for such figures, I have a hard enough time waiting for a bus.

Yep, the return of the "Christ" personality just seems so Christian to me.

[John Sorensen]

The Christ Entity would be an easier way of saying it.

The entity incarnated into three simultaneous personalities (one was Christ, one was John the Baptist, I forget the other, perhaps Peter or Saul?) who each did their part in playing out the religious drama intended to shake people up.

In some systems its said there were actual physical incarnations, while in other systems they existed as a story, the story took on more "life" then in some systems than any purely physical beings ever could.

They each did their part in the play/ act of the Christ drama, which was one telling / retelling of the same timeless tales of consciousness, spirit, god etc, that was unique to the times it appeared in. Often we look back at different eras and totally miss the meanings of such dramas, as we have lost the common social context, both the literal and symbolic meanings of the drama and the Christ Entities purposes, which were multidimensional.

The continued focus on the drama is partly due to the proliferation of Christendom, but on larger world stage these types of dramas have been going on through all recorded history in all societies and cultures, but the details may be dramatically different.

A voodoo based culture for example would have very different figures from a Greek culture, who would have different figures from say hunter gatherer cultures who lived without the written word etc, and had a more direct understanding and perception of reality / the immediate environment that required very little use of symbolism, which seems strange to us when out culture has gone to extremes, where virtually everything we encounter on a daily basis is a symbol of one type or another. The corporate use of Sigils for example is rampant everywhere.

[voidypaul]

    Hi John , Deb ,
                   

                   The thing about the Christ is that He is in some ways bought into existence by the needs of the peoples + times they live in , pulled out of the mass uncons' , +  now is such a time .
                 
                   maybe try + think of this Christ not as some archeological timepiece  as is understood by mainline Christianity but in terms of a an advanced Seth who is reincarnating + is here to help us . Even Seth has said that Christ  has abilities that he still does not have , so He would be a boon to humanity , especialy to those who meet or come to know Him .

                   I would have loved to have met a phys' Seth + would have loved to have him teach me what he knows + be all the more pleased by his physicality because i'd know he aint going far + that i would meet him again + again if poss' , to help me expand my  knowledge + consciousness.      greedy piggy me .

                   Christ in the most simple terms is just a somewhat wiser older more expanded personality than Seth is  that's all .

                  He will have greater powers of communication than Seth , with some He will have direct telepathic + psychic contact , He will be able to commune mind to mind with those close to Him. It may be like a vivd dream or inspiring thoughts come clearly to the surface of cons' but it will be the Christ who is in these vivid dreams + images + He will have something to say directly to each indiv' + to all collectively .
                 What He says will unquestionably affect the deepest portions of an indiv's cons's + move people to come together in a cause that will hopefully unite all of humanity in a common goal , + yes it will have deep relgious significance too but will go beyond the religions as we know them .
                 Religion is simply the whole or mass of the people having a common knowldge of their origins + knowing the freedom of their immortal souls ,  coming togeher to add their energies in trying to attract or bring into phys' reality , the reality of the 'prescence' of GOD or ATI  + the whole of the universe will open up  + they will see 'God' + percieve Him in themselves + everything + this will be a mass , shared + personal indiv' experience wherin unconsc' knowledge becomes cons' + all dreams + incarnations + all entities are glimpsed for  certainly a  mystical moment or two in time . 

                I think that so many people tend to project the old picture of Christ onto the new Christ but He will be a v different personality with a much more 'advanced' story to tell . More Sethian than official religion , + He will meld the apparently opposing belief systems of science + religion , intellect + intuition  into one psycho/physio/religious/spiritual philosophy + experience , + stress the importance ,uniqueness + eternity of each indiv' cons' + nothing will be left out .   

                Seth has said this personality is alive now but He is not 'awake' or aware of who He really is  +  that His work will be more or less completed by 2075 . I'd love to meet Him + ask Him a question or two. But fck knows where or when He will make an appearance , Seth was quite tight lipped about this + rightly so , wish i could have asked Seth a few questions too haha .

                So for sure some of us might well come to hear what He has to say + just importantly how He says it , as it will come as inner as well as outer messages + be unmistakably the real McCoy , so to spk' .

               I mean , why the fck did the folks of old become so convinced of the rightness of what Christ or Buddha or whatever 'prophets' there were , had to say ?
              many of these people were not fools or savages , but highly intelligent competent independent personalities who could spot a faud if they had to . I think if you or i John were to meet such a personality i'm more than sure we would both not be fooled or hoodwinked by any pretense , but similarly , i'm sure that if this personality were in His awakened state we would also be just as aware that we were in the prescence of an extraordinary personage indeed.
             
            Seth has said that Christ was able to project/produce a psuedo/physical manifestation of Himself to some of His disciples + communicate to them whilst He was in fact somewhere else entirely + i'm sure Seth aint bull'g when he says this . Fck , i wish i could do that ....      Aware of all of His incarnations + ours too i'd imagine , aware of the infinite realities that coincide with ours + the numberless beings within them , aware of the infinite probable realities in each moment + hand it to us on a plate so to spk to see if we can digest it ...  He will be something, someone extraordinary .

              A lot of what has come down to us may by now be full of gibberish because of the inevitable manipulations + misinterpretations but the origional experience + message must have been most compelling + moving to the people of those times to inspire them to create such a thing as a new religion or  understanding of  communion with ATI + themselves (+ all things)  as One .    A  mystical union .  An experience He may well be able to impart .

             You know , things like that , things that will quite frankly blow our tiny minds , of course , + of course it seems to be something of a mystery to most what on earth this all might consist of or how it will come about but i think there are many clues in the Seth works themselves about the potentials of the true inner self + the entity , for us to be able  to imagine a 'future' personality with abilities we can only dream of right now ,a personality we might percieve in the teachings of Seth + Seth 2 .  And of course , once again (+ i know i yabber) this Christ will be more than this because He will have at 'times', a direct contact with ATI , + that will undoubtedly totally infinitely fck the minds of all who are present at such an ineluctable , transcendent moment .     

            You get the drift by now i suppose . yabber,yabber,yabber .

               voidypeace , paul

[John Sorensen]

People have been saying Christ is going to appear "now" for the last 2000 years.

Why are you saying he is coming now etc?

My prediction is 1000 years from now people will still be saying it.

And if a Christ figure did appear, I'd wager it would impossible to prove who or what it is, given we live in an age of scientific scepticism.

[voidypaul]

    John S ;

            People have been saying Christ is going to appear "now" for the last 2000 years.

Why are you saying he is coming now etc?

       
  Hi John ;

            Because i have had some 'help' from the Christ entity in my OOB experiences so i am aware that this personality is 'close' to this reality + within it in phys' terms, which is why i hope to come face to face with Him in the not too distant future + also because i have the greatest respect for Seth + what he had to say + of course he has said that now is the time + in fact has stated that He is alive now , but is not yet awake or aware of who or what He really is .

           
       My prediction is 1000 years from now people will still be saying it.

And if a Christ figure did appear, I'd wager it would impossible to prove who or what it is, given we live in an age of scientific skepticism.


  paul ;

         I'd also wager that you are some sort of a scientific or intellectual skeptic yourself John as in your posts you seem to have a paucity of mystical experience or understanding just as the so called scientists do .
     
         Also you refer to Christ as an it , haha , rather an obviously derogatory term that a scientist would use .   Have you ever had an OOb exp' John or any kind of mystical exp. at all ?

         As i have said , this Christ will be an exceptional personality + will be able to communicate on an inner personal + mass level with indiv's + humanity as a whole , do you not see the mystical nature of such unusual communication ?  Or do you ignore it deliberately so you can continue with your skepticism ?  You obviously do not understand what true religion is as yet + because of your closed book stance it may be unlikely that you would allow yourself the pleasure of such contact or exp', just as the scientists do .   Scientists by en large are shallow + critical when it comes to mystical exp' or miracles as they are known , because they are somewhat deluded by their scientific arsehole intellectualism + cannot see further than their own asses even tho proof has been offered up so many times + even tho they understand such a minute fraction of the Real reality .

       Have you ever had faith in anything John ? I don't particularly mean religion , which is in a terrible state right now but in your your own immortal + eternal soul + that you could do things that you have only perhaps dreamed of or wished were true ?

      Your attitudes to incarnation are poor for a sethie mate + maybe you are not v well read but Seth continually asserts this reality but you have missed it somehow + seem to denigrate the idea from your posts but strangely in others you have a begrudging acceptance , you are a complicated person + if i might say a little confused about your spirituality , does it embarrass you to be spiritual ?

      peace , paul
     

[Deb]

People have been saying Christ is going to appear "now" for the last 2000 years.
Why are you saying he is coming now etc?

Maybe because Seth said this, which tends to catch our attention? Certainly more specific than what Christians have been saying for a couple thousand years. Seth say "by 2075" means things could already be in the works, the personality could currently be here in material form, but like anyone else of significance may not be recognized for who or what he is until later on or even after death. Especially if he has no idea of who/what he is himself.

By 2075, all of this will be already accomplished...

But I do have a question about this, which is so far the only place it seems to me that Seth has contradicted himself so far in my reading:

("The entity was born as John the Baptist, and then he was born in two other forms. One of these contained the personality that most stores of Christ refer to... I will tell you the other personality at a later time.")

Paul has mentioned this and I remember reading it myself. Two of the entities were John the Baptist and the one labeled Jesus, the third may have been Saul/Paul. But then Seth says this?!?

The third personality, mentioned many times by me, has not in your terms yet appeared

He also makes the 12 apostles sound like they were aspects of the central CP (oversoul?).

Each of the twelve represented qualities of personality that belong to one individual, and Christ as you know him, represented the inner self.

So it sounds to me like the "return" of the "Christ Personality" (which I am interpreting as a spiritual guide rather than specifically who we consider the actual man Christ--maybe the name "Christ" which is not a name but actually a label--was used by Seth because of he was the most recent/recognizable spiritual treeshaker) is coming now or soon or has recently been material in order to kick ass. Or more gently, to give us a little bit of a push in the right direction, as we seem to have gone off track with spiritual expansion.

[BethAnne]

 Especially if he has no idea of who/what he is himself.
Can you imagine having to deal with this?  If you were the supreme being on the planet who would you have above you to tell you?

[Deb]

Can you imagine having to deal with this? 

My mind always goes back to the Matrix, what a pertinent movie. Neo not knowing who/what he was, the Oracle keeping her mouth shut, Trinity... Art imitating life? Eventually he figured it out.

[BethAnne]

[BethAnne]

[Sena]

It could be that Christ will come spiritually rather than physically. It could happen, for instance, that those who follow Seth's principles may develop the power of healing, and that could be a manifestation of the Spirit of Christ. This healing could range from the healing of individuals to the healing of the Planet.

[BethAnne]

I agree with you Sena.  Maybe that is already happening?  Is that what we are all feeling?  It would have to be an amazing physical person to transcend all the religious division of the world.

I posted in the dreams about a series of dreams two weeks ago with the last one I could physically feel my body being jerked forward that left a shadow of ash that hung in the air for a few seconds.  My girlfriend said she had some weird sensations the same day.  We have both noticed in ourselves and others a "higher" response to situations.  Maybe that is what we are looking for?

[Sena]

It would have to be an amazing physical person to transcend all the religious division of the world.

Yes. If I understand Seth correctly, physical reality is "camouflage reality". It may be a mistake to have high expectations of an amazing physical being suddenly appearing. It would be like the Jews waiting for the Messiah to appear.

[BethAnne]

Isn't that exciting though knowing that something/someone is going to show up that is totally unique. 

[Sena]

"The male aspects of Christ were the ones that Western civilization emphasized. Other portions of his teachings did not follow the main line of Christian thought and were buried.
The church ignored Christ's physical birth, for example, and made his mother an immaculate virgin, which meant that the consciousness of the species would for a longer time ignore its relationship with nature and its feminine aspects. I am speaking now of mainline Western civilization. God the Father would be recognized and the Earth Goddess forgotten." (The "Unknown" Reality: Volume One: A Seth Book in Two Volumes).
In Google Books: http://tinyurl.com/male-aspects-of-Christ

[sethspeaks]

I think that the third personality should have the following basic characteristics:
The True Dream-Art Scientist /session 700/
The True Mental Physicist /session 701/
The Comlete Physician /session703/
or session704

[Sena]

"The Crucifixion story represented, in your terms, now, the self-destructive aspect of the species at the time. And it represents the self-destructive elements of the species in this time for those who still accept it.
'Many religions set up their methods and their dogmas, offering the hope of great knowledge, great understanding, and wisdom. There is only one catch: You must die first!...Some of the basic tenets of Christianity were good, But for all of that, you still have the story that when you suffer and die you will go to heaven, gain knowledge and beauty and truth, and escape this 'vale if tears.'"
(With kindly humor:) "Think what might have happened, and think how your religious books might read, if the myth read differently. Supposing the story read thusly: Christ was not crucified at all. He was not persecuted. He was not chased. He was not scourged, and no one gave him vinegar to drink. Instead, they handed him purple robes, set him up in state at Rome, called him the Christ, the Son of God, but said that the kingdom of God is upon the earth, and salvation is now. What would the priests do? For indeed, knowledge and joy and salvation would be within your grasp. Many religions believe that you must go through trials or walk through fire first. Now, in your terms, that is certainly the most severe trial of all. And a poor way to prove faith. For if you believe in life, you prove your faith by living it. You dare love it. You do not need suffering or trials....' "

Page 203 The God of Jane

From http://www.imaginenolimits.com/SethQuotes2.html

[sethspeaks]

"What so many want is a God who walks down the street and
says,"Happy Sunday, I am I, follow me". But God is hidden craftily
in his creations, so that he is what they are and they are what he is;
and in knowing them, you know him."

ss, esp class session june 23 1970

[BethAnne]

you suffer and die you will go to heaven, gain knowledge and beauty and truth, and escape this 'vale if tears.'"

There is a lot of BS that the Old Priest spun in the Bible but it also holds hidden truths.
I don't think suffering is necessary but it does come with the life you are born into, the distorted beliefs and dogma of family, state and culture.  You have to "die" to those illusions and  one's personal bs which reveals "heaven".

[Sena]

This is the view of "Elias":

"The Christ entity – what is the Christ entity? In actuality, you do not hold a definition for the Christ entity. You hold speculation. You hold theory. You hold ideas/opinions of what this may be, but you do not look to the designation of the Christ entity, so to speak, as you look to a wall within physical matter and express to yourself, 'This is a wall. These are the properties in physical matter of this physical wall. I may identify in physical objective terms what this object is.' You identify the Christ entity as if it is an object, a manifestation, a thing, but you do not identify what this thing is.

I express to you that the Christ entity – or the thing of the Christ entity – is a symbol. It is what you present to yourselves as an explanation or a symbol, a figurehead, a focal point of a movement of energy which may be identified in the manifestation of an individual or of one essence manifest into many individuals. What be the difference? It is merely a difference in terms – once again, our term of terms! (Grinning) And...."

http://www.eliasforum.org/digests/Seth_Jane.html

From the Seth audio collection:

"But behind and within those myths are the realities of your being - the Christ and the Buddha are both within you, for they are symbols of what you are. Pray to them and you pray to the hidden gods within you. You do not need to kick them aside like a child irritated with his toys!"

http://www.sethlearningcenter.org/q_god_religion.html

[sethspeaks]

I think Elias is abortive copy of Seth.
For me Seth is God's voice.
And the difference is noticeable.

[BethAnne]

I'm just throwing this out there for consideration.  Who really knows??  I do sense that the gal on the right is "true".  Her name is Kim Babcock and has her own site. 
The Gal on the left was raised atheist and the Erik she is having channeled is her son who committed suicide.  What struck me was that regarding Jesus, so many people have the Christmas Story stuck in their heads and are looking for a literal story line while Kim is trying to explain the spiritual concepts.   
Example.  A circle is a geometric shape...a dinner plate...a clock shape....OR a Circle as a symbol means so much more on a grander scale.

[JimK]

I can sense the sincerity/love factor with Kim. The other gal, I get...picky,picky,picky. Just my impression. For me, I think I've got enough explanation through Seth. And, again, that's just my thoughts.