Author Topic: Evidence of the return of the Christ personality?  (Read 119 times)

Offline Deb

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Since we don't have enough Christ topics ( ;) ) I thought I'd start yet another one. If any of you have seen other "signs" of Seth's prediction, please share. This has been in my mind since this:

Quote from: Sena
The failure of the Roman Catholic Church to deal with the abuse problem is the final proof of their spiritual bankruptcy. One of the root causes of the problem is the compulsory celibacy for priests and nuns, but they won't dream of giving that up.

BTW the part "he will not be generally known for who he is" (below) makes me feel that he will not be associated with religion in any way, i.e. not a minister or glorified guru, in order to be credible to a wider audience. So he'd have to be of the sciences, I think. Physics or something equally universally respected. Certainly not a politician. And reasoning with the people of the world to see things differently without directly confronting their current religious beliefs, which will naturally fall away on their own.

"(9:20.) He will not come to reward the righteous and send evildoers to eternal doom. He will, however, begin a new religious drama. A certain historical continuity will be maintained. As happened once before, however, he will not be generally known for who he is. There will be no glorious proclamation to which the whole world will bow. He will return to straighten out Christianity, which will be in a shambles at the time of his arrival, and to set up a new system of thought when the world is sorely in need of one."
—SS Chapter 21: Session 586, July 24, 1971

"(9:25.) By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis. He will undermine religious organizations — not unite them. His message will be that of the individual in relation to All That Is. He will clearly state methods by which each individual can attain a state of intimate contact with his own entity; the entity to some extent being man’s mediator with All That Is."
—SS Chapter 21: Session 586, July 24, 1971

Evidence:
The Horrific Catholic Church Sex Abuse Scandal Is About to Get a Lot Worse


"If you think Pennsylvania was bad, wait until you get to New York and New Jersey."

Hey, the Pope wears a watch. Or is that a FitBit? Sorry, lol.

So abuse is just confined to the US? Nope.

The ball is rolling.


Offline jbseth

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Hi Deb, Hi All,

What a fun topic Deb, thanks for starting it.  :)

I’ve always been intrigued by this portion of the Seth information. I like trying to figure out the details about this person, from the information Seth gave us.

Not to disagree with you Deb, but I think that this personality “will” be religious or spiritual in nature.  I think that while he probably will be a person with a spiritual message, he may not necessarily be affiliated with any specific religion. In talking about this personality in Seth Speaks, Session 586, Seth says the following:

“He will, however, begin a new religious drama.”

“This personality will refer to the historical Christ, will recognize his relationship with that personality; […]”


 
In Session 586, Seth says:

“As happened once before, however, he will not generally be known for who he is.”

I take this to mean that generally speaking, he will not be recognized as the second coming of Christ.  Originally, I also took this statement to mean that he would not be “well known”, but this isn’t necessarily the case. This person may be someone who is very well known, but just not recognized as the second coming of Christ.


Seth says that by the time that this person arrives, Christianity will be in shambles and all religions will be in severe crisis.  I figure that this is probably at least one generation away and maybe two.

I can see how the Catholic Church could definitely be in shambles by then, but it’s harder to see how the other religions (Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, etc.) will be in a severe crisis. Maybe it’s just that by the time this personality lives, many of the people of the world will recognize the same issues with all of these religions that we, this Seth group, see today, as a result of our individual backgrounds and Seth’s teachings.

jbseth


Offline Sena

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Quote from: Deb
He will return to straighten out Christianity, which will be in a shambles at the time of his arrival,
Christianity in the West is doomed, but it could persist in Africa and Asia. Nice to have something like Candomblé:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Candombl%C3%A9

"Music and dance are important parts of Candomblé ceremonies, since the dances enable worshippers to become possessed by the orishas. In the rituals, participants make offerings from the mineral, vegetable, and animal kingdoms. Candomblé does not include the duality of good and evil; each person is required to fulfill his or her destiny to the fullest, regardless of what that is."
« Last Edit: September 12, 2018, 09:07:19 PM by Sena »

Offline Deb

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Quote from: jbseth
Not to disagree with you Deb, but I think that this personality “will” be religious or spiritual in nature.  I think that while he probably will be a person with a spiritual message, he may not necessarily be affiliated with any specific religion. In talking about this personality in Seth Speaks, Session 586, Seth says the following:

“He will, however, begin a new religious drama.”

“This personality will refer to the historical Christ, will recognize his relationship with that personality; […]”

Go on and disagree, I'm here to learn.

Dang, I do remember reading that, but I just can't imagine how anyone but Christians will be open to someone saying he is related to JC. And yes, we're a ways off because not all religions at this point (even Catholicism) are in complete shambles. I can hardly wait.  ::)

I guess I still have a problem with the word "religion" because in my eyes religion has been so misused and distorted—used to punish, destroy, control, judge. Spiritual, I can accept. All I can think is that we need another religion like we need another diet. Am I too pollyannish to think people can change their attitudes and behaviors based on understanding and reason, and learning how to love, respect and tolerate others and all that is in our world without religion? But Seth did say... and maybe my definition of religion is different than what Seth meant. I should research that.

I'll not be around "here" in 2075, at least as this person, and even then Seth said things would merely be in place at that point.

"By 2075, all of this will be already accomplished. The birth will occur by the time given. The other changes will occur generally over the period of a century, but the results will show far before that time.

"Because of the plastic nature of the future, in your terms, the date cannot be considered final. All probabilities point in its direction, however, for the inner impetus is already forming the events."

SS, Session 586

Quote from: Sena
Nice to have something like Candomblé:

This looks really nice, Catholicism must play a very small part in it. There are some people who follow religions that can be tolerant and accepting of others who don't share their beliefs, and don't use religion as dogma, but as a way to celebrate and uplift. I really appreciate people who can be this way, I think that's what "it's" all about. Maybe prejudice is a human weakness. It's not limited to religious beliefs.

Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
Not to disagree with you Deb, but I think that this personality “will” be religious or spiritual in nature.  I think that while he probably will be a person with a spiritual message, he may not necessarily be affiliated with any specific religion. In talking about this personality in Seth Speaks, Session 586, Seth says the following:

“He will, however, begin a new religious drama.”
jbseth,
A religion can mean many different things. It seems to me that the Sethian concept of All That Is fits with Taoism:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/taoism/

Offline jbseth

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Hi Sena,

Usually, when I use the word “religion”, I’m typically referring to entire set of beliefs and practices of those people who practice that religion. Of course, for most religions, there are several variations, as with Buddhism for example, where there is Theravada, Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism and so the beliefs and practices within any given religion do vary somewhat.

I have noticed that in many of the world’s religions, there are some “aspects” of some religions that are similar to some of Seth’s concepts. For example, I think the Hindu concept of “Prana” and the Taoist concept of “Chi” are similar to Seth’s concept of the energy or “vitality” of “All That Is”.  I also personally believe that the Taoist concept of “Tao” is very similar to Seth’s concept of “All That Is”.

However, that being said, I’m not sure that any of the world’s religions are actually similar to all of Seth’s concepts and visa versa.  Along these same lines, Seth did say the following in Seth Speaks, Chapter 17, Session 568: 

“[…] Now the same thing applies to each of your great religions, though as I have said in the past, the Buddhists come closer, generally speaking, to a description of the nature of reality. They have not understood the eternal validity of the soul, however, in terms of its exquisite invulnerability, nor been able to hold a feeling for its unique character.”


jbseth

Offline jbseth

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Hi Deb,

This message is in response to your comment in reply #3 where you said,

Dang, I do remember reading that, but I just can't imagine how anyone but Christians will be open to someone saying he is related to JC.”


I “think” that this third Christ personality probably won’t be affiliated with any major religion. While I know I may be completely wrong about this, here’s the reasons for coming to these conclusions.

In regards to when this third Christ personality arrives, Seth says that “By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis.”  If this is true, then it seems to me that anyone at that time who is affiliated with a major world religion would likely have very little credibility with people. Especially, in regards to their personal religious philosophy. 

In addition to this, Seth also says that “He will undermine religious organizations — not unite them.” At that time, I would think that people would be willing to listen to him because he “doesn’t” represent a major religion and because what he says “undermines” these religious organizations.

This is why I don’t think that he will be affiliated with any major world religion.


Seth says that, “His message will be that of the individual in relation to All That Is.” Because of this, it seems to me that his message will be very much like Seth’s. Thus, I’m guessing that he’ll probably talk about “All That Is”, reincarnation, the nature of reality and how these all work. 

Seth also says that, “he will not be generally known for who he is.” This makes me think that perhaps, while he will understand his relationship with the original Jesus, he may not spend much time, if any, talking about it.  Otherwise, why would people not know who he was? Maybe it’s just that many people who weren’t followers of his messages didn’t believe this about him or maybe it’s just that, by that time, with Christianity in shambles, many people just won’t care.

I’ve spent a lot of time pondering these things because I’ve always been intrigued by this Seth concept.  I don’t know that I’m necessarily right on any of these conclusions, but it’s definitely fun to ponder them.

jbseth 


Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
Usually, when I use the word “religion”, I’m typically referring to entire set of beliefs and practices of those people who practice that religion.
Hi jbseth,

The administrators of the great religions are the forerunners of modern marketing organizations - They want to sell the entire package. If you get Windows 10 on your computer, Microsoft will be pushing you to use all the associated "apps" like the Microsoft Edge browser. I try to resist this pressure by using the Chrome browser.

If the Second Christ comes with a religion, I would hope that he does not stoop to the level of Microsoft.

Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

Today, September 16, 2018, the Dalai Lama says that he knew of sex abuse of Buddhist teachers since the 1990's.  This is the first time that I've ever heard of this.

I wonder if this problem, across the various religions, isn't aggravated and potentially the result of the belief in the need to deny the flesh.   Its very sad that this is occurring.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/dalai-lama-i-knew-of-sex-abuse-by-buddhist-teachers-since-1990s/ar-BBNnDZ3


In regards to the second coming, in Seth Speaks, Chapter 21 Session 586, Seth does say:

" [...] By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis. [...].

jbseth

Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
By that time, all religions will be in severe crisis.
The persecution of Muslims by Buddhists in Mayanmar is really nasty.

Offline Deb

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Quote from: jbseth
I “think” that this third Christ personality probably won’t be affiliated with any major religion. While I know I may be completely wrong about this, here’s the reasons for coming to these conclusions.

I agree.

As far as “he will not be generally known for who he is,” I take this to mean that people will not immediately be aware that he is here directly to straighten the world out spiritually or that he is part of the Christ entity. He will have to find a way to have ALL people listen to him. But to appeal to the entire planet—that's ambitious.

And yet this still troubles me: “This personality will refer to the historical Christ, will recognize his relationship with that personality; […]” I wonder if he will at some point reveal the truth behind the Christ myth? Whoa. That would certainly put the last nail in Christianity's coffin.

Quote from: Sena
If the Second Christ comes with a religion, I would hope that he does not stoop to the level of Microsoft.

Nice one Sena, that cracked me up! But you have a good point there, it seems religion has to be accepted as a whole—one chink in the wall and the whole belief system could crumble. About 20 years ago I discovered Deepak Chopra and was playing a recording of him on TV. My born-again sister in law was visiting at the time and she ran from the room covering her ears and eyes, saying something like "I can't watch that, it goes against our Lord." Deepak was saying, at the time, how wherever we are, we are the center of the universe, surrounded by infinity.

Oh wow, JB, the sex abuse of Buddhist teachers was a new one to me (the Muslim persecution too, I've always romanticized Buddhism as peaceful, kind and spiritually advanced). I kind of expect the abuse in Catholicism, maybe because I've always heard about it. I blamed that on the chastity vow. But then sex abuse seems to be rampant in all sorts of organizations, by people in positions of trust. Schools, offices, scouts, military, politics/government, medicine. I've been on the receiving end myself. I wonder what it is that can make people be sexual predators? Maybe that type of person is drawn to positions of authority.

Offline jbseth

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Hi Deb,

In your previous post, in regards to the new Christ personality, you said:

“He will have to find a way to have ALL people listen to him. But to appeal to the entire planet—that's ambitious “


I’m not sure this will be a problem for him, considering what Seth says about him and Jesus.


First, in TES5, Session 203, Seth said:

Your Christ had abilities which I still do not have... […]

Now that’s quite a statement. 



Then in Seth Speaks, Session 586, Seth said:

The third personality of Christ will indeed be known as a great psychic, for it is he who will teach humanity to use those inner senses that alone make true spirituality possible.”



If this third personality will be “known” as a great psychic, and if he has abilities like Jesus, that Seth doesn’t even have, then I don’t think he’ll have any problem gaining world-wide attention.  :)


jbseth



Offline usmaak

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Quote from: jbseth
“He will, however, begin a new religious drama.”
I enjoy reading the Seth material and have been reading it for many years.  There is quite a bit of it that I have a difficult time believing in.  This return of Christ thing is one of those things I don't believe in.  But then, I don't believe in religion in general or that JC ever actually existed.  I've always believed that the bible is actually just a set of stories to keep people in line.  I've never seen any evidence that it is anything else.

The thought of a new religious drama actually makes me feel queasy.  I very much dislike religion.  Very much.

Offline Sena

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Quote from: usmaak
This return of Christ thing is one of those things I don't believe in.
usmaak,
The only Christ I would accept is one that was completely different to the one fabricated by Saints Paul and Augustine and the Catholic Church. We have a good test for the second Christ, because he will say, "I agree with everything Seth said".

Offline Deb

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Quote from: usmaak
But then, I don't believe in religion in general or that JC ever actually existed.  I've always believed that the bible is actually just a set of stories to keep people in line.  I've never seen any evidence that it is anything else.

I've long felt that myself: a complete distaste for religion, and was not sure JC ever existed and didn't really care. But Seth has made me at least be open to the idea that Jesus did exist as a person (I'm not at all saying you should be too, just trying to explain where I'm coming from), but he was totally blown out of proportion by Christianity, the Bible, etc. and ulterior motives. I personally explored and somewhat settled this "issue" for myself elsewhere here.

The only reason I became even remotely interested in the Christ personality is because it comes up so much in the Seth materials. It's either important, or it was only important to Jane and to a lesser extent Rob, because of Jane's early heavy absorption in religion. To me it doesn't really matter whether Jesus ever walked the earth. Seth has said the whole crucifixion drama was not real, was a psychic event, the man known as Jesus is not the person we think of as the legendary Jesus the Christ. I also feel there tends to be a seed of truth at the base of every myth and legend.

But if there is going to be a return of that strong entity, I look forward to this:

"The third personality of Christ will indeed be known as a great psychic, for it is he who will teach humanity to use those inner senses that alone make true spirituality possible. Slayers and victims will change roles as reincarnational memories rise to the surface of consciousness. Through the development of these abilities, the sacredness of all life will be intimately recognized and appreciated."
—SS Chapter 21: Session 586, July 24, 1971

True spirituality, not a new religion. And the "new religious drama" could mean the end of religions entirely, as they will be in a "shambles" by then. Taking religious beliefs away from people alone would eliminate a major divisive component in humanity. This crumbling of dogmatic beliefs would, I hope, open people's minds to new ideas.

The "great psychic" part is interesting to me, as currently the majority of people and about all of science don't believe psychics are real. I did a search yesterday on "great psychics 2018" and didn't find anyone who stuck out in my mind. I think we have a way to go.

And yes, it would certainly be great if he would be a Seth fan.  8)


Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

For me, probably the biggest issue I’ve had with the Seth information is trying to figure out “why” Seth placed so much emphasis on this “Second Coming” story.

This just didn’t seem to make any sense to me, especially because it seems so inconsistent with his general message where he says that predictions often don’t work because we create our reality and others can’t always correctly predict what reality we will choose to create.

Furthermore in his general message he also talks about probable realities and how there are other realities that exist that we don’t experience.  For example, in the beginning of Chapter 16 in “Seth Speaks” Seth gives an example where he says a friend calls you and wants you to meet him at five o’clock, and you consider: (A) saying no and staying home, (B) saying no and going somewhere else and (C) saying yes and keeping the engagement. Seth says that all three of these realities do, in fact, occur somewhere though in this reality we only experience one of them.


Given this then, “I” interpret Seth’s general message as saying that there are realities where Jesus never existed. There are realities where Jesus existed and his existence was that described in the New Testament. There are realities where Jesus existed and his existence was that described by Seth as one of the three personalities of the Christ entity, and there are other realities where Jesus existed and his existence was different than any of these.

Along with this “I” also interpret Seth’s general message as saying that in the future, there are realities where no second coming will occur. There are realities where a second coming will occur and these realities will be like what most Christians believe will happen. There are realities where a second coming will occur and these will be like what Seth says will happen and there are realities where a second coming will occur and the events in these realities will be different than any of those previously mentioned.


So then I asked myself, given that this is Seth’s general message, why would he have emphasized his specific “Second Coming” scenario. 


One plausible answer that I’ve come up with, has to do with what he talks about in Chapter 15 of Seth Speaks, on Re-incarnational Civilizations; this is the chapter where he talks about the Lumanians.   In this chapter, Seth says:

In a manner of speaking, it can be said that you have reincarnational civilizations as well as reincarnating individuals.” 

Then, in this same chapter, Seth also says:

Groups of people in various cycles of reincarnational activity have met crisis after crisis, have come to your point of physical development and either gone beyond it, or destroyed their particular civilization.”


I believe that, as a society, we have reached a point where we can very easily destroy ourselves if we aren’t wise about the choices we make. This destruction could come about due to any number of situations like nuclear war, environmental disaster, overpopulation, or even perhaps the “terminator” movie scenario for example.

I think that Seth knew that one of the future probable realities, where we don’t destroy ourselves, has to do with the “Second Coming” scenario that he told us about.  By having us believe that his “Second Coming” scenario is actually going to occur in the future, we will then create it by our belief and as a result of this, we won’t end up destroying ourselves in the meantime.

“I” truly believe that this is the real reason why Seth emphasized this “second coming” scenario, and since I see the wisdom of this, I willing choose to go along with it.

I don’t expect other members of this forum to necessarily agree with me on this and that’s OK, we are all on our individual paths.

However I,  for myself, haven’t come up with any better ideas to explain why Seth may have chosen to emphasize his “second coming” scenario, given what he says about predictions, how we create our reality and the nature of probable realities.

jbseth




Offline Deb

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Quote from: jbseth
For me, probably the biggest issue I’ve had with the Seth information is trying to figure out “why” Seth placed so much emphasis on this “Second Coming” story.

Yep, I'm with you there. As I mentioned above, I tend to think that Jane had a lot to do with that. Seth did answer a lot of questions that Jane and Rob posed, and both Jane and Rob were very interested in the Christ story so that probably added a lot to the Christ-related content. Seth offered a book on the subject, but somehow that never happened in this reality. I'm not forgetting that Jane also could block Seth when he was about to disclose something that made her feel uncomfortable, so by the same token did she manufacture some info? And there were no doubt some distortions. There were also other times when I've questioned things attributed to Seth in the books that just didn't feel like Seth to me. For instance, dietary recommendations from the man who said it is more important what you feel about what you eat than what you actually eat. Seth did say to not take his words as dogma, that could easily excuse some of that grey area.

Quote from: jbseth
This just didn’t seem to make any sense to me, especially because it seems so inconsistent with his general message where he says that predictions often don’t work because we create our reality and others can’t always correctly predict what reality we will choose to create.

I don't have a problem with that part, I've been somehow able to rationalize it away by feeling that when he was saying those things, he was addressing the Jane and Rob and the rest of us that are in THIS current reality, where probabilities have lead up to where we are now and with the history we know. Yes, there are other probabilities where things transpired differently. And he did say that due to free will, the future cannot be accurately predicted, but that in this case (at least with regards to the 2075 date) "all probabilities point in [that] direction." So the return seems to be the plausible option. But not guaranteed. I kinda think if the probabilities were that low, he would not have even mentioned it.

"Because of the plastic nature of the future, in your terms, the date cannot be considered final. All probabilities point in its direction, however, for the inner impetus is already forming the events."
SS, Session 586

Quote from: jbseth
By having us believe that his “Second Coming” scenario is actually going to occur in the future, we will then create it by our belief and as a result of this, we won’t end up destroying ourselves in the meantime.

Now THAT'S an interesting thought. Belief is huge. I know I've had the feeling that Seth had a lot of affection for the Earth as we know it: the people, his lives, Rob and Jane. Would he try to influence us with disguised insider information? I don't know, but he often hints of clues that are there for us in this reality.

Today someone put this quote up on a Facebook Seth group and I really liked it. It's from channeled material from a woman named Pat Rodegast, her channel source was named Emmanuel. I'm not interested in pursuing Emmanuel, I have what I need from Seth, but I thought it was beautiful and talks about beliefs.

Quote from: Emmanuel
The moment you believe in something, you have created – literally - a reality. The moment you believe in something – the moment that you give something credence - no matter how improbable or impossible it may seem to be - the moment you allow it into your framework of belief - you have given it, not only probability or possibility but reality. That is how unencumbered, and how powerful you really are.

I'm ready for a shakeup. It feels like we've been on this treadmill waaaayyyyy too long.

Offline usmaak

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Quote from: jbseth
By having us believe that his “Second Coming” scenario is actually going to occur in the future, we will then create it by our belief and as a result of this, we won’t end up destroying ourselves in the meantime.
This makes me uncomfortable because it goes against what Seth has always seemed to be, at least to me.  In spite of benign intentions, it would be manipulative and against our free will (if our free will choice is to destroy ourselves in this reality).  If I accept this premise, then I have to wonder what other distortions were introduced into the material with benign intentions and that makes me question what is "real" and what is not.

Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
I think that Seth knew that one of the future probable realities, where we don’t destroy ourselves, has to do with the “Second Coming” scenario that he told us about.  By having us believe that his “Second Coming” scenario is actually going to occur in the future, we will then create it by our belief and as a result of this, we won’t end up destroying ourselves in the meantime.

“I” truly believe that this is the real reason why Seth emphasized this “second coming” scenario, and since I see the wisdom of this, I willing choose to go along with it.
jbseth,
This is very interesting. So the Secong Coming, if it occurs, will be a reality created by us.
I have been reading about Dostoevsky. According to him, humans as a mass are usually not able to make rational decisions. An example is the Brexit vote in the UK. A people with a generally high level of education have chosen a path which is going to hit many of them economically. It was an emotional decision rather than a rational one.
So perhaps Seth was trying to influence the emotions of his readers in order to dissuade them from destroying themselves.

 

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