Author Topic: Disintegrating Entities? Session 54, Early Sessions Book 2  (Read 137 times)

Offline Deb

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Part 1.

Original Facebook post, Larry Rush, Fans of the Seth Material, July 4, 2019:

"I was asked by Lynda [Madden Dahl] if I wanted to start a fresh thread with the Seth Entity disintegration question. So the question is, what are the full implications of an Entity choosing to disintegrate itself? What does this mean for the Oversoul if only the individual personalities remain. Does it mean the Entity, in disintegrating, is no more a functioning soul with consciousness? How does this read across to other statements Seth has said about Identity?"

I've been pondering this Facebook post since July 4 and have wanted to create this topic since then. But first I wanted to read Session 54, The Early Sessions, Book 2 (where the idea of disintegrating Entities comes from). Session 54 is so interesting to me, that I decided to type up almost the entire session. The only things I've omitted are some of Rob's unrelated comments and material that was not related to entities and how they and everything else are constantly changing. Sorry if there are any typos. I have broken this down into three posts because it's so long. The underlines are from the book, the bracketed [ ] text is mine.

There are no indices in the Early Sessions books, but thankfully Mary Dillman has an "after-market" PDF indices of these books, so I will go through that to find more info about entity disintegration and what that means in the scheme of things, and then update this topic.

I read most of the comments by people, many had a lot of misunderstandings and outrage, for instance "If “disintegrate” is meant as “destroy into bits” I believe it is a mis-translation on Jane's part. The entity already consists of “bits” so disintegrate can only mean “destroy.” Seth makes it abundantly clear that consciousness cannot be destroyed- much less the entity/soul in which consciousness is but an attribute. If an attribute of the entity cannot be destroyed then how can the entity itself be destroyed? That makes zero sense."

From Session 54:

(Reading the 3rd session, of December 6/63, John noticed that Frank Watts, Jane and I had all lived together in Mesopotamia in the 4th century B.C. In that life I was a woman, Frank Watts was my sister, and Jane was a brother to us, and named Seth. During these first sessions it will be remembered that Jane and I received our information from Frank Watts. Seth did not announce his presence until the 4th session. Now John wondered if the Seth mentioned in the 3rd session, page 18, was the same Seth who is now giving us the material.)

Good evening...
[some Rob notes and some information about Miss Callahan]

You have not asked me, and so I did not tell you. Nevertheless, there is no distortion in the particular material which you have been reading. Your Ruburt was, indeed, Seth. Your Ruburt spoke with my voice, for it was his voice.

There is no invasion involved in these sessions, as I have told you often. I have promised to give you more material dealing with the psychic construction of the entity, and its relationship to its fragments. I could not tell you in the beginning in so many words that Ruburt is myself, because you would have leaped to the conclusion that I was Ruburt's subconscious mind, and this is not so.

When you understand the construction of entities, then you will understand how this can be so. Rubert is not myself now, in his present life; he is nevertheless an extension and materialization of the Seth that I was at one time.

Nothing remains unchanging, personalities and entities least of all. You are still thinking in terms of concrete things. You cannot stop an entity or a personality in time, as you would like to do. I am Seth today. I keep my continuity but nevertheless I change, and offshoots like currents explode into being.

As an idea changes, so do entities change while still retaining individuality and durability. But you cannot set up imaginary barriers, and stop or freeze my identity, nor for that matter your own.

Ruburt was myself, Seth, many centuries ago, but he grew, evolved and expanded in terms of a particular, personal set of value fulfillments. He is now an actual gestalt, a personality that was one of the probable personalities into which Seth could grow. I represent another. I am another.

I have mentioned to you that endless personalities, in terms of value fulfillment, exist inherent in each of your physical atoms, molecules and smaller particles. So, also, each entity contains within itself almost endless possibilities in terms of value fulfillment.

As the physical atoms and molecules combine to form cells, and the cells to form physical organs, and as they do not lose their individuality in so doing, and as the atoms and molecules themselves actually gain and share in higher perceptions because of this gestalt, so do the basic components or fragments of an entity constantly form new and varied personalities; and these in turn for entities of their own.

I realize that this is somewhat difficult, but when you reread the last two sessions you will understand this material completely. Ruburt is now the result of the Seth that I once was, for I have changed since then. Ruburt represents, and is, a personality formed by that Seth which was myself, by focusing upon and using a peculiar set of attributes and abilities. To make it simpler, perhaps, we split, this being necessary always so that various possibilities can be brought into action.

Ruburt has changed since then, and so have I. And yet we are bound together, and no invasion occurs because in one way of speaking our psychic territory is the same. I will go into the construction of entities later. My own emotional feeling, you see, goes outward, which is away from Ruburt often, since basically we are tempted to think of ourselves as one, though actually our roots are merely the same.

I suggest you take your first break.

[Continued in Part 2.]
« Last Edit: July 09, 2019, 07:42:37 PM by Deb »

Offline Deb

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Part 2. Seth, continued:

There is indeed no contradiction, though it may appear so, in the fact that all entities existed before your planet was formed, and the fact that fragments form new entities. I have told you that your conception of cause and effect is faulty and antiquated, and I have said that the cause and effect theory is logical only as a result of your theory of time and continuity. If time as you think of it does not exist, and it does not, then the cause and effect theory does not follow.

I have told you that all consciousnesses exist in the spacious present, which is spontaneous while also durable. Then it is no contradiction to say that if entities existed before the birth of your planet, though in your time it seems that new ones are being brought to consciousness.

In their materialization upon your plane, and as seen from your own camouflage perspective, you seem to be aware of new entities, but this is because of your own limited viewpoint. In your time scheme entities have had time to produce more fragmentary personalities, but in truth from your viewpoint these personalities can be seen to have changed long ago.

The old analogy, rather trite I'm afraid, is still a good one. Walking through a forest you find many trees. Time can be conceived of, truly, as the entire forest. You however see a tree in front of you and call it the future. You think that the tree was not there because you had not come to it yet. The tree behind you, you call the past. You are walking so to speak along one narrow path, but there are many paths. The forest exists as a whole. You can walk forward, so to speak, and backward, though you are only now learning how.

We will carry this analogy a giant step further. Now we will call the whole forest, if you can conceive of it, the spacious present. The trees are compared to consciousnesses, all existing simultaneously; and yet this forest of spacious present does not take up space, as you think of space.

There is no past, present or future in your terms within it, but only a now. Because of the endless possibilities within this now, durability is maintained in terms of value fulfillment, and the fulfillment of literally endless values. Therefore the forest is constantly expanding. Remember your expanding universe theory, but not in terms of space or indeed in terms of time, but in terms of fulfillment of abilities and values that may be constructed upon various levels and in various disguises, your present plane of existence being one.

And in each of these planes of existence there is a reflection of the basic laws of the spacious present itself, which I am in the process of giving you. Therefore there is no need, really, to think of a given group of entities before the birth of your planet. I have said that all the entities who would ever dwell upon your plane did exist, and actually have a hand in on the creation of your planet, that would ever dwell upon it.

I also said that new entities were being formed, but in the framework of the spacious present all this is spontaneous. The contradiction seems a contradiction you may say, in truth on your own terms, that entities simply have had time to develop further personalities. But I want it understood that this is true only within your own time framework.

There is much yet to be covered dealing with a spontaneity that is nevertheless durable. I have also said that your own present existence occurs simultaneously. You only perceive it in slow motion.

I suggest you take your break, and if this hasn't broken you up then nothing will. You are indeed as you can see broken up a million times, and put together in many various manners; and yet you retain the inner ego, and in other words your own identity. But this identity must change. This again is no contradiction. Nothing can be static, and believe it or not, nothing is.

An entity can indeed in some ways be compared to a tree that brings forth many seeds, the seeds being individuals in themselves, with all the potentialities to become themselves full entities.

Many, as I have said, do. That is, many fragment personalities do become entities. We are dealing here with a psychic tree however, and the seeds or personalities that do not develop into entities, do not because they do not choose to do so.

I will go further and shock you thoroughly, by mentioning that your regular seeds that do not develop, do not fail as a rule because of a lack of the necessary environmental ingredients, but simply because, for various reasons during a particular arbitrary point, they do not choose to so develop.

This applies to the seeds of any flower or tree or person. I have told you that consciousness is in all things, and the power behind all things. The entity itself constantly changes, and an entity can indeed choose to disintegrate.

You see the growth process in a very distorted manner, because of your antiquated cause and effect theory. Growth on your plane is merely the reflection, or one of the reflections, of value fulfillment, seen through the distorted lens of your perspective.

Change, as you must know, involves not only growth but a complete disorientation, to make way for a different, perhaps newer, orientation. You see value fulfillment in terms of growth, and therefore think of disintegration in terms of psychic destruction and death. That is, you see an ending as the effect of any beginning.

This is indeed unfortunate, since there is only a change of form, one form fading into another form. There is no actual point of death, in your terms. You cannot set a certain time to even an individual death, any more than you can set a time for any individual birth.

The change is always gradual, even in so far as your own perspective is concerned. The change is gradual because the change is spontaneous. If the change were not spontaneous and not ever occurring and reoccurring, then you could say "now this is the moment of birth or death."

Even on your own plane, as seen in the physical corpse itself, the physical image does not suddenly cease. In fact, you have an old superstition in some parts of your own country, that a man is not truly dead until everyone who ever knew him is dead. And this is true.

It is true because everyone who is acquainted with a particular individual creates his own image of him, as he creates his own image of them. As long as memory of a particular individual is alive, that particular personality still exists upon your plane, and this is not always to his advantage.

I will have more to say, per usual. I suggest your break, and keep in mind that I will speak more on the construction of the entity, the tree analogy being a good one, because all of our imaginary seeds do not develop into trees. This does not necessarily mean, either, that there is a deficiency; merely that the consciousness involved does not choose for one reason or another to materialize fully in a particular form, or to develop any given abilities along certain lines. This may also represent a needed resting point.

And you also now take your resting point.

[Continued in Part 3.]
« Last Edit: July 09, 2019, 07:48:24 PM by Deb »

Offline Deb

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Part 3. Seth, continued:

At the same time you know of what I am speaking, at the same time you are aware of all that I say. Otherwise it would not make any sense to you at all.

A certain level of personal comprehension, and a mixture of personal discipline and freedom is necessary. In order for this material to come through, you must have already reached an element of inner freedom, and a certain ability to realize your own existence behind the camouflage patterns with which you are usually concerned.

You have read of so-called mediums—and I detest the term—speaking gibberish, the explanation being given that the so-called spirit could not come through. Nevertheless so-called gibberish in such an instance merely represents, when it is legitimate, the fact that no new comprehensions or knowledge can be so transmitted entirely by the means of an entity speaking from another plane.

The individuals receiving such knowledge already are capable of understanding it, and their own inner ego helps them in this comprehension. I have been against the deep trance for this reason, in that I prefer to work with you in such a manner that you are able to use this knowledge consciously, and also feel that you have a part in its delivery.

We will now go into one of our basic laws of the universe, and of the spacious present, which would seem to need little explanation: that of creation.

On your plane each atom and molecule contains the potentiality for any physical construction whatsoever. Each atom and molecule contains, as I have said, a generalized consciousness, in which all of the basic laws are known, and also a limited but definite self-awareness.

This self-awareness in each atom and molecule determines what sort of cell or combination that the particular atom or molecule will form. The cells then, being a gestalt, contain the individual conscious components, which then form a consciousness greater than the consciousness of any individual component within, and different in scope and ability.

In other words the whole in almost any case is more than the sum of its parts. Yet the inner consciousness of the individual atoms and molecules is not changed; but each of them combine to form this extral— E-x-t-r-a-l value, that is, a value greater than the sum of individual parts.

The cells combine into other patterns, forming finally into your physical organs. When the whole physical body is constructed, the individual personality-consciousness is again more than the sum of its component parts.

It is more than the combined consciousness of its atoms. Here is your creation; this creation, occurring constantly, it as I have said one of the laws of the inner universe. We know now that the consciousness behind each atom and molecule gave physical construction to the atom and molecule. That is, the consciousness came first.

The consciousness always comes first, representing individualized, extremely potent bits of energy that compose the basic or inner universe. They materialize upon your plane, forming their blocks of construction. The creation that causes the whole to be more than the sum of its parts is merely the inner identities, the bulk of this consciousness not able to fully materialize upon the physical plane. In other words, no consciousness fully materialized upon the physical plane.

I suggest your break; and this last point is an important one to remember, for I am getting more help from you, from your inner egos, than you realize.

A small note to Ruburt concerning his ESP book. I hope by now he realizes that extrasensory perception is a poor term at best. Inner sense perception would be a much more accurate description. Nevertheless, he is far ahead since he dispensed with material from other researchers and relied upon his own.

There is no other researcher, if I may say so, who has the excellent teacher that you have, and your own experiments with psychological time will certainly give you more than enough to say, and later give you evidence that can hardly be denied.

[Following this, personal material to another session participant, hints of inner laws of the universe, Jane and Rob's psy time experiments, end of session. ]

« Last Edit: July 09, 2019, 07:48:40 PM by Deb »

Online jbseth

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Hi Deb,

What a great topic.

I remember when I first read this in either TES1 or TES2, I was really surprised by the idea. As far as I know, Seth never said much more about it, which leaves a lot of room for misinterpretation, from whatever he may have meant to say.

What a great topic for digging into.




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