Author Topic: Possession & "Drawing Down the Spirits"  (Read 198 times)

Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

Ever since I saw the movie, “The Exorcist” many years ago, I’ve always been rather unsettled about this whole “possession” concept. One problem that I’ve had with it is that I don’t really know whether this is something that actually occurs to people, or if it’s just some perhaps superstitious belief that’s not really true.  Another problem that I’ve had with it, is that it seems to be really difficult to determine whether this really is something that actually occurs to people.

Some of the things that I’ve wondered about in regards to this topic, are these:


1
Is this a real valid thing? Can people, for example, become possessed by malicious spirits when playing around with a Ouija board, for example?

2
Is it nothing more than just a superstition, like a belief in vampires and werewolves?

3
Is it something that could be true for those people who believe it and yet is not true for those people who don’t. Is it possible that belief is a primary influencer here where the actual truth of it is very much dependent upon a person’s “belief”?

4
Is it a hold over belief from non-technical societies and cultures of the past where things like epilepsy, schizophrenia and Tourette’s syndrome were not understood and as a result of this, things like these were all believed to be caused by “evil spirits”?

5
Is this something that the Christian church believes in because the Bible says that Jesus removed or drove out “demons” or “evil spirits” from people?

6
Is this something that the Christian church believes in because the fear of it, keeps people in line?

7
Are there any people out there who have actually been “possessed”?




While I don’t have any real answers to many of these questions, I do have some  answers to question 7. Yes, there are definitely people out there, who, as it turns out have been possessed. However, this situation is somewhat different than the situation that occurred in the movie, “The Exorcist”.



Recently, I finished reading the book, “Drawing Down the Spirits”, by Kenaz Filan and Raven Kaldera.  In this book, these two authors talk about some of their experiences with being possessed by spirits, on several occasions. These authors have done this, intentionally, as members of their specific religious groups.

Kenaz is a Vodou Houngan, a practitioner of Vodou while Raven is a Northern Tradition Pagan Shaman, a practitioner of a Neo-Pagan religious group.  Some people would say that what each of these groups practice, is a form of “witchcraft”.

Here’s a link to this book, for anyone who’s interested.


https://www.amazon.com/Drawing-Down-Spirits-Traditions-Techniques-ebook/dp/B004C05GYY/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=drawing+down+the+spirits&qid=1599021049&sr=8-1

I thought I’d share some things that these two authors had to say about possession in the spoiler below.
 

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There are many more things that the authors have to say about spirits and possessions in this book.


In Chapter 11, on page 222 of this book, the authors make the following statement about uncontrolled possessions and malevolent spirits.

Given that this belief in uncontrolled possessions and malevolent (or at least harmful) spirits is found throughout history and around the world, it behooves us to take it seriously. And once we accept that it exists, we arrive at the next important question: How do we avoid it?



The statement “Given that this “belief” in uncontrolled possession“ takes me back to Question 3 above.  Is it possible that this possession issue really has a lot to do with a person’s belief about it?

Seth does tell us that beliefs are very powerful in the way that they influence us.

Do some people, like the authors and perhaps some Christians face the risk of becoming “possessed” because they “believe” that a spirit can possess them? Do others never have to worry about this, because they don’t believe in it?
 
While I don’t know the answer to this, at least now I do understand that there are some people, who do regularly participate in some form of “spirit possession” work.


-jbseth



Offline Deb

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Great topic! I remember seeing The Exorcist when it first came out. The guy I was dating at the time took me to NYC to see the movie, and I was so sickened and horrified that we cancelled our dinner plans afterwards. Ewww, pea soup! Lucky for him, as we planned on Steak 'n Ale (not cheap). Although I was raised on horror flicks, The Exorcist began a whole new generation of the horror genre.

So, here goes:

1) I don't know if possession is real, but the closest story to real I've come across to make me wonder about a girl https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watseka_Wonder who was supposedly possessed in 1877 by what I've otherwise heard called a "walk-in possession." What makes the story more believable for me is there are newspaper articles about her situation. The Booth Brothers (same guys who made the documentary about Waverley Hills) made a documentary about that case that was very convincing. As far as Ouija boards, to me they are just a focusing tool such as a pendulum. A way to get in touch with the inner self for people who think they need some some gadget to do so.

2) Again I don't know. I imagine that if a personality who is not currently in physical reality suddenly has a mission to accomplish, I can see the "resident" personality agreeing to step aside and allow the other personality to take over and "drive the car" for a while, the same way Jane stepped aside to let Seth come through in the sessions. I don't believe in evil, demons, satan or victims. I have a friend/client who is "the world's foremost expert on Ouija boards" ( https://robertmurch.com/ ) and he feels the same way.

3) Yep. You make your own reality, and get what you focus upon.

4, 5 & 6) I think it was a way for past ages (and religions) to explain and deal with mental illness. I remember going to Peru and buying a pendant that was called a tumi, a representation of a trepanation knife, one purpose being to evacuate evil spirits from the head of someone behaving abnormally.

The Exorcist was loosely based on a true story. It's so hard to know what to believe, as everyone seems to have an agenda.

7) See 1 above. :)

Watseka Wonder. Worth a watch, in my opinion.

« Last Edit: September 08, 2020, 08:19:15 PM by Deb »

Offline jbseth

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Hi Deb,

Hey thanks for your comments.

Sorry to hear about your “The Exorcist” experience. Looking back on it now, seeing how horror movies have progressed over the years, it seems kind of mild by today’s standards.  Although it was definitely very ratched up over what we would see on the Donna Reed show, Gilligan’s Island or the Brady Bunch. It definitely raised the horror movie industry to a higher level.


I didn’t know about the Watseka story. Thanks for sharing that. That story in the Wiki link was really incredible.

I know about the Anneliese Michel, story which first came out right around the time of “The Exorcist” movie. I’ve always thought that it was interesting that she seemed to be very religious, in the Catholic Religion.

https://allthatsinteresting.com/anneliese-michel-exorcism.



I’m with you on the Ouija boards. I wouldn’t think that people would be able to use them, without being trapped or tricked into being possessed, it they were really that dangerous.  How is it that Jane and Rob were able to do so, without being possessed?
The fact that they weren’t, makes me think that there must be something else that goes on here.

That trepanation knife sounds a little like other similar horror stories I’ve heard about this possession thing.

Before reading this book, I didn’t actually realize that these people who participate in Vodou, were actually inviting spirits to come into them and take over.


One final thought, here, from what I can tell, this possession thing seems to be extremely rare because you almost never hear any about it. It certainly doesn’t appear to be as common as, cancer or heart attacks.


-jbseth

Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
Is this something that the Christian church believes in because the Bible says that Jesus removed or drove out “demons” or “evil spirits” from people?

jbseth, possession is a common phenomenon in primitive and relatively unsophisticated societies. The modern view is that possession is a form of "dissociation" (split personality). It could be said that Jane Roberts was "possessed" by Seth, but the difference is that Jane had control over what happened and chose to open her psyche to Seth.
There is a theory that possession was an essential feature in the genesis of Christianity. Palestine in those days would have been a relatively unsophisticated society where possession was common. I am not saying that actual "demons" were involved. The event of Pentecost where the Holy Spirit is said to have descended was a clear instance of possession (dissociation). "Speaking in tongues" is a dissociative phenomenon.
Dissociation is rather common in people who have experienced childhood sexual abuse or physical abuse (Jane Roberts was emotionally abused by her mother and possibly sexually abused by a Catholic priest). This may have been the case with some of the followers of Jesus, and may be why Jesus advised people to leave their families and follow him.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dissociation_(psychology)

https://www2.rivier.edu/faculty/pcunningham/Research/Problem_of_Seths_Origin.pdf

"It is no great stretch to conclude that this mother-daughter relationship is a classic case of
disorganized attachment. Possibly, Jane's prior internment at the orphanage may have acted as a buffer
against the damage that this treatment might otherwise have incurred at an even earlier developmental
stage. Nonetheless, it is hard to imagine that a young child could endure this situation without serious
consequences to her personality development.
As if this weren't bad enough, Jane also endured at least several instances of sexual abuse at the
hands of visiting priests. Watkins tells us, “according to Rob's notes in The Way Toward Health […], it
began when Jane was a small child. 'We talked a lot about the priests in her life', Rob writes for May
18, 1984 […] 'She described again those visits from Father Trenton. She talked about how the one
priest who put her to bed when she was but three or four years old would “play” with her sexually...'”208
Watkins was apparently surprised to uncover this abuse: “Jane never said much about this to me, and
the few comments she did make, about a priest who 'chased her around the bed', were delivered
casually in group settings, with deprecating humor, no hint of the frightening child-molesting scenario
[…] that Rob's notes make plain.” She tells us, “Such things were not openly acknowledged or
discussed in those days, and thus I didn't (or wouldn't) recognize the iceberg beneath Jane's
remarks..."

https://tinyurl.com/y6otyumx

« Last Edit: September 09, 2020, 01:36:52 AM by Sena »

Offline jbseth

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Hi Sena, Hi All,


Thanks Sena, you’ve made some great points.

I’ve often wondered about some of the prophets in the Hebrew Bible or Old Testament, whether what they were doing when they “Spoke for God” was not just some form of channeling like how Jane channelled Seth, or maybe even possession where the possessing spirit was an evolved spirit like Seth.

Several years ago I read a book called, “No God but God”, by Reza Aslan. This book was about the history of Islam. I didn’t know much about Islam, at that time as I’ve never been interested in it; it seems to be too conservative and extreme to me. Anyway, what I discovered is that Mohammed, more or less had a channeling / possession type of experience, when he received his messages from God, Allah, in the cave. Much of Mohammed’s messages, were then “later” written down and this became the Quran.   It was this new awareness that came to me, at that time, that led me think about what the “Prophets” of the Old Testament were doing.



Your point about the Pentecost is really interesting too. That does sound like a possession experience to me.



Do you think that most psychologists and psychiatrists view this concept of possession, like that shown in the movie, “The Exorcist”, as being the result of dissociation rather than perhaps schizophrenia?  Here I’m thinking about the “Son of Sam” killer, back in New York City, in the late 1970’s who supposedly heard his neighbor’s dog “Sam”, talk to him, and tell him to go kill people, or something along those lines.  I’m assuming that he was schizophrenic.


I’m curious as to what you think personally. Do you think that it’s possible that there could be malicious “spirits” out there that can take over a person’s mind and/or body? This being something completely independent of either dissociation or schizophrenia.

-jbseth


Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
I’m curious as to what you think personally. Do you think that it’s possible that there could be malicious “spirits” out there that can take over a person’s mind and/or body? This being something completely independent of either dissociation or schizophrenia.

jbseth, there are said to be beings called "hungry ghosts". According to Sethian principles, I would think that these beings can only affect you if you "invite them in", either consciously or unconsciously. These hungry ghosts are lost souls, nothing like the mythical Christian devil.

Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

In regards to the topic of possession, today I came across some material that seems to give a great explanation of what this is all about. I found this explanation in the book, “Answers from a Grander Self” which was written by Tam Mossman. Tam Mossman was Jane Roberts editor for many of the Seth books. It turns out that Tam Mossman, channeled many messages from his higher self, his Grander Self, which he refers to as “James”.  This book, “Answers from a Grander Self”, contains nine chapters of channeled information directly from “James” himself.

https://www.amazon.com/Answers-Grander-Self-Tam-Mossman/dp/0963294709/ref=sr_1_1?dchild=1&keywords=answers+from+a+grander+self&qid=1599690349&sr=8-1


In Chapter 1 of this book, James explains who he is. He also explains a little about how the psyche works and the three levels of discarnate intelligence. Then along with this, he also responds to a question that was asked, regarding whether possession, as depicted in the movie, “The Exorcist” really occur. I’ll paraphrase what James has to say about this in the two spoilers below.

In the first spoiler I’ll briefly paraphrase what he said about how the psyche works and then I’ll paraphrase what James says about the three levels of discarnate intelligence. I’m doing this because this information ties directly into what he says about possession, which I’ll briefly paraphrase in the second spoiler.

Again, I think that this is some of the best information that I’ve seen on this topic.


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- jbseth



Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
It turns out that Tam Mossman, channeled many messages from his higher self, his Grander Self, which he refers to as “James”.  This book, “Answers from a Grander Self”, contains nine chapters of channeled information directly from “James” himself.
jbseth, this is interesting, but you need to be clear that what you have quoted does NOT come from Seth or Jane Roberts. I think I prefer to stick with the Seth teachings in this instance,

Offline jbseth

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Hi Sena,

Yes, you are correct. The “James” material that was channeled by Tam Mossman, is not from Jane Roberts or Seth. However, it is what I’ll term “Seth like” in nature.


On Page 7 in this book’s Introduction, Tam says that, “Jane Robert’s work largely molded my own metaphysical thinking.” This is why he says that readers of Jane Roberts will notice that James uses a number of terms and concepts originally coined by Seth.

This can be seen throughout the book. For example, in Chapter 1, when asked who he is, James replied with the following.  “I however am better described as a gestalt, a self-aware linking up of what would - to you - seem a multitude of separate conscious individuals… a goodly number of whom are still alive and well in your present world.”

He also says, “So it is with conscious identity: although my “components” are able to exist independently, when linked up on my non-physical level, they are able to coalesce into yet another, higher level of consciousness that I identify as “me”.”

This sounds very much like what Seth describes as an “Entity” or “Oversoul” to me.



I’m not trying to convince anyone here that they have to believe or accept the channeled information from “James” as valid. That is your choice. Some of you may and some of you may not. But to me, the important point here is that some of “James” concepts are based upon Seth’s ideas and he directly responded to a question regarding the concept of possession as presented in the form of the movie, “The Exorcist”.

That I’m aware of, Seth never did this. He never did directly respond to a question regarding the concept of possession as presented in the form of the movie, “The Exorcist”.  He did however occasionally talk about possession and related concepts scattered throughout much of the Seth literature.  I’ll also post some of the interesting things that Seth had to say about possession here as well.


I think we’ll find that some of both Seth’s ideas and James ideas on this topic are similar.


- jbseth

Offline LarryH

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Permit me to go a little off-topic and go a little deeper into Tam Mossman. I also have a copy of his book Answers from a Grander Self, and I thought it was one of the better non-Seth channeled works. I also have 9 or 10 issues of the classic quarterly Metapychology, which Tam originated and edited. It consists entirely of channeled material from numerous channelers. Decades ago, I read a pulp fiction horror novel, 666, which Tam wrote under a pseudonym. If you take the first letter of each chapter, they spell (if I remember correctly), "Tam Mossman wrote this book". And don't bother to look for it. First, it's not worth the read, second I just checked, and it's not on Amazon. But one last thing: my ex had lunch with Tam before we were married, and his "grander self" shared some thoughts about our then upcoming marriage in a follow-up correspondence. Neither of us remembers what he said, though! I think it said something like "If such-and-such happens, the marriage will be successful." I guess "such-and-such" didn't happen, though we got two great daughters out of the deal.

Offline Deb

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Personally I feel most "possessions" in history were simply mental illness, such as schizophrenia, dissociation or even multiple personality disorder.

I did read Tam's book too (Larry, I remember you got a signed copy). While I enjoyed it, some of it just didn't feel 100% to me, as if Tam wasn't channeling, so much as rehashing, what he'd learned from the Seth materials. Maybe not consciously. And being the editor, he was deeply familiar with the books.

I've been curious what Seth said about possession, so I searched on exact:possession and was surprised to find these (the most interesting of the results):

"Worry itself will, however, induce (he may have said “duplicate” ) a state similar to the preliminary stages of possession. (A person) never becomes possessed unless he has requested it, (when he is not interested in, or afraid of life, and would like another to take over the job.)"
—TES9 Postscript To Session 454 December 7, 1968

"Also don’t let your imagination follow along the lines of possession... Fear of this creates a state in which a semblance of that can be caused. Most cases of possession are not caused by spirits... although it does exist in those terms... usually caused by those who request it or are too lazy to live their own lives within ... Such people then issue a blank invite to control the body they no longer wish to control."
—TES9 Session 454 December 7, 1968

That Anneliese Michel article was quite the story. She seemed extremely mentally ill to me. There are stories like hers (Emily Rose) and "Roland Doe," the boy the Exorcist movie was made about, that are the seeds of truth behind books and movies that are 99% sensationalism. I don't have a problem with that, it makes for a good story. I'm just constantly amazed how many people believe stories presented as "based on true events."

Seth also mentioned poltergeists! But only twice:

"Now the change in the colors represented a sort of poltergeist activity on your part."
—TES8 Session 400 March 20, 1968

"Far be it from me to bump fair ladies on the head! The bump, for this has been a very active evening, was from your playful poltergeist AA. I have better things to do than to bump maidens or madams on the head."
—TES9 ESP Class July 15, 1969

Offline LarryH

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Quote from: Deb
"Worry itself will, however, induce (he may have said “duplicate” ) a state similar to the preliminary stages of possession. (A person) never becomes possessed unless he has requested it, (when he is not interested in, or afraid of life, and would like another to take over the job.)"
—TES9 Postscript To Session 454 December 7, 1968

"Also don’t let your imagination follow along the lines of possession... Fear of this creates a state in which a semblance of that can be caused. Most cases of possession are not caused by spirits... although it does exist in those terms... usually caused by those who request it or are too lazy to live their own lives within ... Such people then issue a blank invite to control the body they no longer wish to control."
—TES9 Session 454 December 7, 1968
It sounds like Seth is talking about what Ruth Montgomery referred to as "walk-ins". It is unclear as to the nature of the entity entering the body in these cases. He just says the possessions are "...not caused by spirits...". I have always thought of our between-life states as being in a spiritual realm, implying that we are spirits in that realm. So if we have the option of being someone's "walk-in", would that not be as a spirit? Or maybe a walk-in immediately identifies as a physical being, whereas "spiritual possession" might be where the spirit maintains its "spiritual" identity while it possesses the body.

Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

In regards to “possession”, Seth doesn’t actually say all that much about it, although he does mention it specifically on a few occasions (see spoilers for 1, 2, 4 and 8 below). However, he does say quite a bit about several other related topics.  This includes demons and a belief in demons, Janes “black thing”, which appeared to be a demon, schizophrenia and how it can make a person appear to be possessed, states of dissociation, and thought-forms.

Below I’ve identified 8 sessions where Seth either talked about possession itself or a seemingly related subject; I’m sure there are others as well. For each one of these sessions, I’ve summarized what he had to say in the session itself.

In the sessions below, the page numbers at the end, are the page numbers of the specific version of the book that I own. These may or may not be the exact same pages, in your books.



1 TES1, S15, p88:
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2 TES9, S454, p191 & p193:
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3 TES9, S471, p274 – p275:
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4 TPS1, S593, p279 – p283:
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5 SS, Ch7,  S530, p85, 86:
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6 SS, Ch10, S538, p139:
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7 NOPR, Ch6, S628, p108:
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8 DEaVF2, Ch9, S921, p396:
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- jbseth



Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
Also don’t let your imagination follow along the lines of possession... Fear of this creates a state in which a semblance of that can be caused. Most cases of possession are not caused by spirits... although it does exist in those terms... usually caused by those who request it or are too lazy to live their own lives within ... Such people then issue a blank invite to control the body they no longer wish to control.
jbseth, thanks for the quotes. Useful warning from Seth.

Offline Deb

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Quote from: LarryH
He just says the possessions are "...not caused by spirits...". I have always thought of our between-life states as being in a spiritual realm, implying that we are spirits in that realm. So if we have the option of being someone's "walk-in", would that not be as a spirit?

It would. It took me a little while, but I've come to the conclusion that what Seth meant is that spirits don't cause the possession, it's caused by the person who invites them in. Kind of like how it works with vampires. :)
« Last Edit: September 11, 2020, 05:06:23 PM by Deb »

Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

After thinking about what Seth had to say about possession and other related topics, here’s what it sounds like to me, is going on with all of this.


1) Possession does occur. It does exist. Those who are in control of their lives won’t be possessed. In most cases possession isn’t caused by spirits, but it does exist in those terms. Fear of possession can cause a semblance of it.  Possession is usually caused by those who request it or those who don’t want to live their lives. These people will offer a blank invitation to be possessed.


2) Many people who exhibit schizophrenia may appear to be possessed but aren’t. Schizophrenic people sometimes deal with a conflict that exists within them between a primary and a secondary personality. This can look like possession.


3) Most authorities within the Roman Catholic Church, realize that almost all of those who are supposed to be possessed, are people who are mentally ill.  However, the Roman Catholic Church must admit to the separate reality of Satan and the demons because their existences are given in the Gospels.


4) We create thought-forms all the time. For example, when we think fondly of the seashore, we sometimes send a thought-form of ourselves out to the seashore. We all do this, all the time. There are many thought-forms.
 

5) Jane created the “black thing” that then attacked her in an OBE state. She created this thing unconsciously. These types of things are energy-forms not thought-forms (I’m not sure what the difference is here) and they do contain a consciousness. They do know others of their kind and they can communicate with the psychic or spiritual levels of consciousness of living persons.


6) Other thought-forms and other peoples thought-form can and do exist. You can meet them in the inner environment.  In SS, Ch10, S538 Seth also says, “So if you believe you will be met by a demon, you will create your own thought-form of one, not realizing that it is of your own creation.”


7) Evil doesn’t exist. Evil isn’t a force in itself. Evil actions occur as the result of ignorance and misunderstanding. Man is to realize that he is responsible for his acts, good or bad (he can't just blame this on evil spirits of Satan).


- jbseth

Offline Deb

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Quote from: jbseth
Then Seth tells us that these beings (helper and black thing) can be seen by others who either travel through or within those realms. He says that they are not thought forms but rather they are energy forms. Seth say that they know others of their kind and they can communicate with the psychic or spiritual levels of consciousness of living persons.

This reminds me of the black thing I saw at Waverly Hills Sanitorium. I've often wondered if it was an energy ball of fear and anguish.

The building was built in 1920 as a hospital for people suffering from tuberculosis. They did a lot of horrendous things to patients in trying to help them and I've read that either 63,000 or 5,000 people died there (maybe the CDC was doing the reporting, lol). Once the cure for TB was figured out, the building became a geriatric center (1962) for severely mentally handicapped patients. It was closed in 1982 because the conditions were poor, it was overcrowded and there were reports of patient neglect. All of that seems like good reasons for fear and anguish.

I guess I'll never know.
« Last Edit: September 11, 2020, 05:16:58 PM by Deb »

Offline jbseth

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Quote from: LarryH
Quote from: Deb
"Worry itself will, however, induce (he may have said “duplicate” ) a state similar to the preliminary stages of possession. (A person) never becomes possessed unless he has requested it, (when he is not interested in, or afraid of life, and would like another to take over the job.)"
—TES9 Postscript To Session 454 December 7, 1968

"Also don’t let your imagination follow along the lines of possession... Fear of this creates a state in which a semblance of that can be caused. Most cases of possession are not caused by spirits... although it does exist in those terms... usually caused by those who request it or are too lazy to live their own lives within ... Such people then issue a blank invite to control the body they no longer wish to control."
—TES9 Session 454 December 7, 1968
It sounds like Seth is talking about what Ruth Montgomery referred to as "walk-ins". It is unclear as to the nature of the entity entering the body in these cases. He just says the possessions are "...not caused by spirits...". I have always thought of our between-life states as being in a spiritual realm, implying that we are spirits in that realm. So if we have the option of being someone's "walk-in", would that not be as a spirit? Or maybe a walk-in immediately identifies as a physical being, whereas "spiritual possession" might be where the spirit maintains its "spiritual" identity while it possesses the body.


Hi LarryH, Hi Deb, Hi All,


Wow, I haven’t thought about Ruth Montgomery and the “walk-ins” for a long time.  



In TES9, S454: Seth says:

Most cases of possession are not caused by spirits... although it does exist in those terms.”

I take the word “Most” to mean, many but not necessary all, cases of possession are not caused by spirits. This indicates that “some” cases of possession are caused by spirits.

I’m with you LarryH, the way I interpret what Seth says in “Seth Speaks” about who we are after we die, in between lives, is more along the lines of our astral body, not a physical body.


The walk-in thing, assuming that it’s legitimate, and that could be another discussion, I’m not sure that it was necessarily a “possession” experience.

I’m thinking that might be something more along the lines of Jane and Seth’s relationship, where Seth told Jane that she gave permission for the relationship and yet, Jane had no conscious knowledge of ever doing so.

Actually it sounds a little like Augustus One and Augustus Two, in NOPR, Ch 6, S628, where Augustus One just caved-in and let Augustus Two take over completely, so maybe it was a possession thing. I don't think that a possession experience necessarily has to be the situation where a bad spirit took over. It seems to me that there are probably times when a "good" spirit takes over someone as well.


- jbseth



Offline jbseth

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Hi All,

It turns out that if you really want to understand it, what Seth had to say about “possession” was rather complicated. The complexity here comes from the fact that there are many other interacting related issues involved with it. Some of these issues include, demons and their nature, self-created thought forms, other people’s self-created thought forms, beliefs, schizophrenia and understanding the nature of evil, just to name a few. This reminds me of the complexity that’s involved in the nature of mass events. Which is neither simple nor easy to either unravel or explain.


In TES9, S454, Seth tells us that possession does occur. It is a real thing.
He also tells us that most cases of possession are not caused by spirits, although it does exist in those terms.  He says that it is usually caused by those who either request it or no longer wish to control their lives. He says that such people issue a blank invite for someone else to control their body. He also tell us that if you are in control you need have no fears of possession.


In TES1, S15 and in NOPR, Ch6, S628, Seth tells us that schizophrenic behavior can in some cases look like possession. However, here something different is going on. Sometimes this involves a fight for control between a primary and secondary personality.


In SS, Ch7, S530, and in SS, Ch10, S538, Seth tells us that we create thought forms all the time. In addition to this, he tells us that in our astral travels it is possible to run into other people’s thought forms as well.


In many places including, SS, Ch10, S538; SS, Ch21, S587; and in NOPR, Ch22, S677, Seth tells us about beliefs and demons and reminds us that we create our reality. Here he tells us that if we believe in demons, then we will create them and we may then experience them, either here in this physical reality or in our dreams and or astral adventures. From our beliefs, we create them.


In DEaVF12, Ch9, S921, Seth tells us that demons have no reality of their own. He says that they are created because man has always projected unassimilated psychological elements of his own personality outward.  In this way, we’ve been able to avoid blaming ourselves for our cruel and debasing acts. Mankind has isolated himself from this responsibility by imagining the existence of demons instead.

He says that mankind must realize that “we” are responsible for our acts, both good and bad. He says that our next step is to assimilate these psychological elements.

He also says that evil is not a force in itself. He says that evil actions are the result of ignorance and misunderstanding. Seth says man’s evil exists because of man’s misunderstanding of his ideals and the gap that seems to exist between the ideal and its actualization.


- jbseth

Offline Sena

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Quote from: jbseth
Mankind has isolated himself from this responsibility by imagining the existence of demons instead.

jbseth, on the topic of demonic possession and exorcism, you may be interested in watching the film "The Rite". This is available on Amazon Prime in the UK. I hope you can get hold of it in the U.S.

Offline jbseth

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  • Posts: 1547
Hi Sena,

Thanks Sena, I haven't heard of that one at all. I'll check it out.   :)

I'll have to work this out with my wife as she's not really all that interested in this kind of thing.
But that's OK too, because it's a real joy being married to her.  :)

-jbseth

 

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