Author Topic: Seth on Jesus the Christ  (Read 898 times)

Offline Deb

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A little bit of the search engine on SethTalks, a little bit of Ron Card, a little bit of Rock n Roll. I've ordered this by date/session number.

TES5 Session 203 October 28, 1965:
Rob: Ruburt is not aware of the Jesuit’s messages, but Seth is.
(Bill remarked that in terms of our existence our Christ was a supernatural being.)
Seth: Your Christ had abilities which I still do not have...

TES5 Session 213 December 1, 1965:

Rob: Jane, very amused, commented every so often that she received little “messages” from a certain party, expressing approval of our actions, and merely suggesting that we do get to the session at least a few minutes before the Instream material was due.
Seth: All the more since you have no particular conviction, anymore than Ruburt has, concerning the historic existence of a Christ.
The legend of Christ is of great psychic import however, and is intrinsically true.

Jane's ESP Class Session, April [1?], 1969:
*([Florence:] “When I think of the millions and millions of lives that have been sacrificed in the name of Christ, in the name of God, the Jewish slaughtered back in the middle centuries with the—in the Crusades—in the name of Christ. You said the spirit of Christ had entered every person, and yet mankind does not reflect this. [...] Seth said before that there is not just one Christ, not just one person that did all the things that Christ did, but many people.”
Seth: Now, you have been given the free will because the spirit of Christ is within you, this does not mean that you do not have free will. The spirit of Christ gives you the life to do with it what you choose.
(Group discussed the concept of Christ.)

TES9 Session 510 January 19 1970:

Seth: My message to the reader will be: “basically, you are no more of a physical personality than I am, and in telling you of my reality I tell you of your own.” ( ron says...AWESOME!)
Seth: ( ron says...Seth was giving a small piece of advance information on what would be in the Christ book here in order to stimulate interest, however, Jane was the "gatekeeper" and she/Ruburt had final control and say on what Seth could SAY. Seth: There will be a chapter on the religions of the world, on the distortions and truths within them; the three Christs; and some data concerning a lost religion (pause; one of many), belonging to a people of which you have no information.

Seth Speaks, Appendix, Session 558, November 5, 1970:

Seth: In your terms, and in your terms only, the coming of Christ was the Second Coming. (Pause.) In those terms — and, again, this is important — in those terms only, he appeared at the time of Atlantis, but the records were destroyed and forgotten except in the memory of a few who survived.

Now, again in those terms, he is an entity who appears time and time again within your physical system, but he has been recognized on only two occasions. Once in Atlantis, and once in the Christ story as it has come down to you in all of its distortions. He appears and reappears therefore, sometimes making himself known and sometimes not. He was not one personality, as I have told you, but a highly developed entity, sometimes appearing as a fragment of himself.

SS Chapter 17: Session 568, February 22, 1971:

(10:21.) In any of these worlds, the Christ drama could never appear as it appeared within your own. [...] But Buddha, like Christ, interpreted what he almost knew in terms of your own reality.
Christian dogma speaks of the ascension of Christ, implying of course a vertical ascent into the heavens, and the development of the soul is often discussed in terms of direction.

SS Chapter 20: Session 578, April 5, 1971:

Seth: Here’s question number one: You said you’d tell us about the third Christ. Also, do we need to know more about the other two personalities belonging to the Christ entity: Christ Himself, and John the Baptist?”)
Rob: Jane’s pace was quite slow.) The Christ entity was one. [...] The Christ entity had many reincarnations before the emergence of the Christ “personality” as known; as did the Buddha.
No — just the questions about the world religions, and those pertaining to the third Christ and allied subjects.

TECS3 ESP Class Session, May 18, 1971:

Seth: Those who need verbal messages most, and I am closing my eyes so no one will be offended, those of you who need verbal messages most, are those who have the greatest doubts about their own inner reality and experiences, (to Bette) but beyond that you distrust anyone who seems to have had a better education in this life than your own, and it is discrimination.
Words cannot convey the message but working from the words you can obtain a portion of the reality behind them.
Now he is a psychic entity and as such he is a valid reality, as Christ is, and you can all study that sentence.

SS Chapter 21: Session 586, July 24, 1971:
Seth: His characteristics, for example, were seemingly quite different from those of the historical Christ. [...] Yet some exploits of his in his earlier life have been attributed to Christ — not as a young man, but earlier.
When the historical Christ “died,” Paul was to implement the spiritual ideas in physical terms, to carry on. [...] He lingered after Christ, [just] as John the Baptist came before.
John and the historical Christ each performed their roles and were satisfied that they had done so. Paul alone was left at the end unsatisfied, and so it is about his personality that the future Christ will form.

SS Appendix: Session 592, August 23, 1971:

Seth: Christ, you see, was to deliver the message and John was to prepare the way for it.
Rob: (Since I knew so little about the time of Christ, it’s taken me a while to do the extra reading necessary so that I could write appropriate session notes.
(The Essene group generally known would be the Jewish sect in the Holy Land during the time of Christ, early in the first century.

TPS2, Deleted Session July 31, 1972:

Rob: Instead of telling us about it, Seth’s letting me feel the emotions of that young girl you were involved with when you were Nebene, at the time of Christ....”
Seth: “Now, I get the messages and you have to write them down, whereas before you had the ancient records and made the copies yourself.

NoPR Chapter 12: Session 649, March 19, 1973:

Seth: Christ as you think of him was simply saying that you form your own reality. He tried to rise above the idea-systems of those times, yet even he had to use them, and so the connotations of sin and punishment distorted the message given.
(See the 614th session in Chapter Two.) This belief in your society also harks back to the Bible and Christ’s association with the poor rather than the rich.

The Nature of Personal Reality, Chapter 21, Session 674, July 2, 1973:

Seth: Christ was the symbol of man’s emerging consciousness, holding within himself the knowledge of man’s potential. His message was meant to be carried beyond the times, but this interpretation is often not made.
There are indeed lost gospels, written by men in other countries in that time, relating to Christ’s unknown life, to episodes not given in the Bible. [...] The messages were given in other terms, but again they reflected the affirmation of the self and its continued existence after physical death.
Regardless, Christ’s message was one of affirmation.

UR2 Section 4: Session 711 October 9, 1974:

Seth: Each of these has its own commercials or messages, which may or may not have anything to do with the programs given.
Seth: Ruburt acts as a receiver when I speak, and so I must make certain adjustments so that my message can be channeled under conditions that involve, among other things, his nervous system and physical apparatus.
In physical terms, however, the message given that evening is still to be presented through these books.

UR2 Appendix 21: (For Session 721):

Seth: You are neurologically tuned in to one particular field of actuality that you recognize.2 In your terms and from your viewpoint only, messages from other existences live within you as ghost images within the cells, for the cells recognize more than you do on a conscious level.
You have several time and space tracks in operation at once, then, but you acknowledge only certain neurological messages physically. Seth to Rob: (To me:) Neurologically, you crossed your messages.

UR2 Section 6: Session 742 April 16, 1975:

Seth: (Long pause.) When a house is vacant all of the people in the neighborhood send out their own messages. [...] Such messages are often encountered in the dream state.
According to some Christian sects, all of this is to transpire at the Parousia, or the anticipated Second Coming of Jesus Christ, during the Last Judgment.

NotP Chapter 1: Session 752, July 28, 1975:

JANE: And I’m not ready for either of the books Seth has mentioned doing — the Christ book, or the one he talked about last month, on cultural reality. ( ron note: here is another reference to Jane putting off doing the Christ book, which seth had "shovel-ready," she was very uncomfortable with what Seth would reveal about Christ that would no doubt draw wide criticism, and it may have been impossible to get a national publisher to even print such an expose.)
(At 11:14 Seth delivered a message to a scientist who had written us, finally ending the session at 11:43 P.M.)

TPS3 Deleted Session November 26, 1975:

Seth: It is easy for you to think in terms of messages taking centuries to pass through space with your technology. In those terms only, some messages can take centuries to pass through the psyche—that greater psyche that straddles the eons.
Christ said that with faith you could move a mountain.
From: SS Introduction book rob chapter students mine
“Through these voices, these intuitions, these flashes of insights and messages, the universe speaks to us, to each of us personally. You are being addressed, and so am I. Learn to hear your own messages, not to distort what you hear or translate it into old alphabets.
Rob: After the first few sessions, the pointer spelled out messages that claimed to come from a personality called Seth.
The messages seemed to begin where Idea Construction left off, and later Seth said that my expansion of consciousness experience had represented his first attempt at contact.

TPS4 Deleted Session January 9, 1978:

Seth: Now: the message of the Christ entity was, in religious terms “You are all children of God—the ‘sinner’ as well as the saint.” Indeed, according to the original Christ thesis, while a man could sin, no man was identified as a sinner.
Rob: See Chapter 21 of Seth Speaks for more on the Christ entity. According to history, Christ was crucified, and the other two members of Seth’s Christ entity, John the Baptist and St. [...] It would be interesting to get more data on the whole Christ question. As I told Jane after the session, Seth’s Christ material tonight reminded me of the idea of the Christ book, which Seth mentioned in Personal Reality.)
Seth: The message was “Do not condemn yourself or others,” for Christ well knew that self-righteous condemnation of the self or of one’s neighbors served to darken the door through which man might view his own potential and its greater source.

NoME Chapter 4: Session 829, March 22, 1978:

Seth: Christ’s message was that each man is good inherently, and is an individualized portion of the divine — and yet a civilization based upon that precept has never been attempted. The vast social structures of Christianity were instead based upon man’s “sinful” nature — not the organizations and structures that might allow him to become good, or to obtain the goodness that Christ quite clearly perceived man already possessed.
Rob: I’d say that in this 829th session Seth spoke out of a knowledge of biblical tradition and history; that is, he wasn’t saying that Christ did rise from the dead or ascend into heaven, but referring to Christianity’s interpretation of its own creative Christ story. Seth has always maintained that Christ wasn’t crucified to begin with — indeed, he told us in the same private session that “… in the facts of history, there was no crucifixion, resurrection, or ascension. In the terms of history, there was no biblical Christ. In the terms of the biblical drama (underlined), however, Christ was crucified.
Seth: Christ, as you know, was a common name, so when I say that there was a man named Christ involved in those events, I do not mean to say that he was the biblical Christ. His life was one of those that were finally used to compose the composite image of the biblical Christ.”

TPS5 Deleted Session September 27, 1978:

Seth: Christ, as you understand him historically to be, spoke in parables and symbols. Men often took him literally, but his message was that the spirit of God was within each person—in terms of the symbolism, each person being a child of the father who dwelled in heaven. But heaven meant an inner reality for Christ, not an exterior one.
For centuries, priests of one kind or another have been put in charge of “reading God’s messages,” and interpreting them to the rest of mankind, just as in later times the scientists have been put in the position of interpreting man’s own world to him—in terms quite as esoteric as those of any religion.

TPS5 Deleted Session November 15, 1978:
Rob: He ignores the message, and sleeps, muttering in protest at the discomfort, and then it takes him another hour or so after breakfast, simply because he did not move the body when it was ready to move.
The Word, by Irving Wallace, is a book on the discovery of an unknown gospel by the brother of Christ, James the Just.

TPS5 Deleted Session December 2, 1978:
Seth: And if you write what you feel it must not matter, for your message wilt reach people all over the world. And if you do not write what you feel then the message has no meaning.
For peace is active *(to Sheri, Rick and Van Zandt.) *And so if there is any message that I have for your students, as usual it is not a quiet one.
([Anne Marie:] “Will that be related to the Third Christ at all?”

NoME Chapter 6: Session 844, April 1, 1979:

Seth: The Christ drama is a case in point, where private and mass dreams were then projected outward into the historical context of time, and then reacted to in such a way that various people became exterior participants — but in a far larger mass dream that was then interpreted in the most literal of physical terms. Even while it was, it also got the message across, though the inner drama itself was not recalled; and as the dream merged with historical events, and as it was interpreted by so many, its message also became distorted — or rather, it mixed and merged with other such dreams, whose messages were far different.
“Because dreams are such a perfect combination of stimuli from the inner environment and the exterior environment, other events are often used to trigger inner dream messages, just as the opposite occurs. And in a gathering of three people watching the same TV drama, say, each of them might be interpreting different portions of the program so that those portions correlate with their individual dreams of the night before, and serve to bring them their dream messages in ways they can accept …
“Great discrimination is used to do that; for example, one newspaper item is noticed over others because a certain portion of that item represents some of the dream’s message. Another portion might come from a neighbor — but from the dreamer’s interpretation of the neighbor’s remarks, that further brings home the dream message.

DEaVF2 Chapter 9: Session 920, October 6, 1980:

Seth: If the messages were to be clearly deciphered and understood, then of course the game would be over, for the one to understand the message would be the united self who [had] felt the need of such camouflaged self-troops (hyphen) to begin with.
Rob: [Later I remembered hearing a bit of that.] Our caller had received a number of pages of information from Jesus Christ.
Seth: The language is an excellent example of the coded messages I mentioned earlier (as I’d thought). It is supposed to remain secret, you see, yet becomes the symbol of the all-powerful knowledge of the exaggerated superior self, while making the knowledge impossible to act upon.

DEaVF2 Chapter 9: Session 921, October 8, 1980: (see Sena's comment below)

Seth: The Christ figure represents the exaggerated, idealized version of the inner self that the individual feels incapable of living up to. [...] He may—or of course she may—on other occasions receive messages from the devil, or demons, which on their part represent the person’s feelings about the physical self that seems to be so evil and contradictory in contrast to the idealistic image.
(Pause.) Communications between various scattered portions of the self often appear, again, in such situations as automatic writing, speaking, the hearing of voices, or through what the person believes to be telepathic messages from others.
The supposedly telepathic messages can be attributed to contemporaries—enemies, gods, devils, or what have you.

« Last Edit: February 04, 2018, 12:51:32 PM by Deb »

Offline Sena

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Quote from: Deb
Seth: The Christ figure represents the exaggerated, idealized version of the inner self that the individual feels incapable of living up to. [...] He may—or of course she may—on other occasions receive messages from the devil, or demons, which on their part represent the person’s feelings about the physical self that seems to be so evil and contradictory in contrast to the idealistic image.
Deb, thanks for all these quotes. DEaVF2 is a book I haven't read. This particular quote - "The Christ figure represents the exaggerated, idealized version of the inner self that the individual feels incapable of living up to" - seems to indicate clearly that Seth did not consider Christ to be a flesh-and-blood human being. Here Christ is a "mythical figure" in the same category as the mythical figure of the devil but in an opposite sense.

P.S. I have now downloaded DEaVF2 for my Kindle. The above quote needs to be taken in context - Seth is there explaining why a person suffering from schizophrenia may consider himself to be Christ.
This is another quote from the book:
"The story of the Creation, as Biblically stated, is the symbolic representation of a master event..... The same applies to Christianity itself, for all of the seemingly historical events connected with the official (underlined) Christ did not happen in physical reality." (Session 928)
« Last Edit: November 28, 2017, 09:39:13 PM by Sena »

Offline Deb

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Quote from: Sena
"The Christ figure represents the exaggerated, idealized version of the inner self that the individual feels incapable of living up to" - seems to indicate clearly that Seth did not consider Christ to be a flesh-and-blood human being. Here Christ is a "mythical figure" in the same category as the mythical figure of the devil but in an opposite sense.

Awesome deduction, but then that makes me again question how much of the information Seth provided about biblical "history" was colored by Jane's early training. But, I don't doubt the quality of most of the information that came through Jane, as I think religion was the biggest thorn in her side. Pun intended.

Offline Deb

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My confusion on whether Seth said Jesus was real or not came from Seth not distinguishing between the man we now call Jesus, the Christ entity (begetting three men, Jesus, John the Baptist, Paul), and the Christ or Jesus Christ figure created by the church and new testament. Seth rarely uses the name Jesus, most times he refers to them ALL as Christ. Christ was a title, Jesus is a name.

So, to sort this out I've looked through several quotes again. My interpretation is that Seth said there was a real man Jesus (Christ), one of the three, that comprised the Christ entity:

Quote
"The Christ entity desired to be born in space and time, to straddle creaturehood in order to serve as a leader, and to translate certain truths in physical terms."
—NoPR Chapter 21: Session 674, July 2, 1973

"There were three men whose lives became confused in history, and merged, and whose composite history became known as the life of Christ, for example"
—TES9 Session 491 July 2, 1969

"John the Baptist, Christ, and Paul were all connected in the dream state, and John was well aware of Christ’s existence before Christ was born."
—SS Chapter 21: Session 588, August 2, 1971

"The church ignored Christ’s physical birth, for example, and made his mother an immaculate virgin, which meant that the consciousness of the species would for a longer time ignore its relationship with nature and its feminine aspects."
—UR1 Section 2: Session 690 March 21, 1974

"The historical Jesus knew who he was, but he also knew that he was one of three personalities composing one entity."
—SS Chapter 21: Session 586, July 24, 1971

But whoever this Jesus-the-man may have been, he is not the 'person' described throughout Christian history. According to Seth, that figure is a myth, a legend:

Quote
“… in the facts of history, there was no crucifixion, resurrection, or ascension. In the terms of history, there was no biblical Christ. In the terms of the biblical drama (underlined), however, Christ was crucified."
—NoME Chapter 4: Session 829, March 22, 1978

"Your Christ figure represents, symbolically, your idea of God and his relationships. There were three separate individuals whose history blended, and they became known collectively as Christ — hence many discrepancies in your records."
—SS Chapter 14: Session 560, November 23, 1970

"The same applies to Christianity itself, for all of the seemingly historical events connected with the official (underlined) Christ did not happen in physical reality."
—DEaVF2 Chapter 9: Session 928, November 12, 1980

"Christ tried to return man to nature. In a manner of speaking, again, there was no one Christ, historically speaking, but the personage of Christ, or the entity, was the reality from which the entire dramatic story emerged."
—TPS4 Deleted Session January 23, 1978

So after all of this, I'm thinking Seth does not contradict himself, it was just a matter of sorting out who he was referring to when he said Christ in the various quotes.

It also now seems to me that the books saying Jesus never existed could be the same issue of lumping together Jesus the man and Jesus the Christ figure. They are all saying that Jesus the man was manufactured, but maybe what they really mean is the person we think of as Jesus, the Christ figure, never existed, is a legend composed of previous mythical figureheads, old testament, ancient gods and fables, inflated attributes and stories meant to be parables, allegories or just plain bull. I suppose I'd have to read all of them to know for sure. I won't.

Sorry but you are not allowed to view spoiler contents.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2018, 04:23:42 PM by Deb »

Offline LarryH

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Quote from: Deb
So after all of this, I'm thinking Seth does not contradict himself, it was just a matter of sorting out who he was referring to when he said Christ in the various quotes.

Deb, that matches my position. I do have a minor issue with Seth's discussion of Christ, where he said somewhere that Christ was a common name at the time. I thought when I read it that he meant the name 'Jesus' (in whatever form it was at the time), not the title 'Christ'. Although, it is possible that the term for 'Christ' was taken on as a mantle by many, pretenders to the position, as it were.

Offline Sena

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Quote from: Deb
They are all saying that Jesus the man was manufactured, but maybe what they really mean is the person we think of as Jesus, the Christ figure, never existed, is a legend composed of previous mythical figureheads, old testament, ancient gods and fables, inflated attributes and stories meant to be parables, allegories or just plain bull.
No, Deb, it is not just plain bull. I posted a quote elsewhere on this site which stated that a "myth" is something very important but difficult to put into words. This may explain the apparent contradictions. If we look at what Neville Goddard wrote, it is clear that he is also trying to understand the Christ myth, but it may be that we should try to look at the underlying meaning of his words:
"As your own wonderful human imagination Christ is telling you that he knows you are afraid, that you have obligations in life which must be met, but to not be afraid for “I will go and prepare a place for you.” Knowing this, close your physical eyes upon the world round about you and let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid, for all things are possible to Christ in you! Let him prepare the state, for he is the way to its fulfillment."

http://realneville.com/txt/christ_in_you.htm

Offline Christer

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Christ means the anointed one, and as customs was in Egypt at the real time when Christ walked among us was that kings and priests was anointed. All three Christ personalities was in fact Egyptian kings, all belonging to the Armana-period. Akhenaton starting the whole, forcing mono religion on the people (The biblical Moses, and in my opinion also John the Baptist). His son King Tut, is the historical Jesus. And Paul is King Tut`s general Horemheb, that was anointed as king 4 years later than the supposed death of King Tut. Anyway all Egyptian kings was the incarnation of the God deity, hence bible always referring to Pharaoh as the Lord, so when Pharaoh spoke indeed God was speaking. Mary was off course impregnated from a Pharaoh, hence she was made pregnant with God. It is no hocus pocus, only a misunderstanding of the customs at that time in Egypt, and hence the mental framework they where acting inside. Before the Armana incident it was Horus that was the main deity, and after it came Seth, later translated as Satan the Antichrist. The main deity in the Armana-period was the Aton, or the sun-God, representing the one God and that we are light. Anyway it is true what Seth are telling us, Paul, or Horemheb denied his involvement with the Christ-entity, he did in fact destroy the history of the other 2 personalities, but later had an epiphany that made him change his mind. After that he built the organization as Pharaoh Horemheb (non-royal birth), and he gave the throne to Ramses I, that was the beginning of the problems with Christianity when followed bye Seti I that changed the main God from the Sun-God (Amun or Aton) to Seth, and this continued threw the 19.dynasty. The archeology has proven the Bible to be manipulated, names changed, historical places changed, and in fact a cover up of what really happened 3500 years ago. The episode happening 2000 years  ago was the mental and psychic happening, the episode involving the Armana-kings is the history with the real persons, hence the second coming was psychic and not physical. As Seth states, the history was deleted, it was deliberately forgotten, and proof is that later on when Ramses II made his famous steale listing all Egyptian kings and their deeds back to the first dynasty, all the Armana-royalties was erased from history less then 20 years later. In fact this cover up is the reason why king Tut`s tomb was found undisturbed and with a body inside. I do not state that the body really is Jesus due to Seth`s comments about the conspiracy made with the drugged want to be Jesus figure.

Bits and bits of information is scattered around the globe, but I have a deep focus into this and has discovered that the Pharaoh history back to pre-Pharonic era is the story in the Bible of the beginning with the first dynasties representing the walk out of the garden of Eden. The story of Cain and Abel we do find in the story when Seth kills Osiris, and both was ancient kings named Djer and Djet. The biblical Salomon is identified as Amenhotep III, the biblical King David is identified as Thutmose III, and the biblical Joseph that reads dreams are Yuya appearing around Amenhotep III`s reign. Amenhotep III is the father of Akhenaton, he was married to queen Tiye that was the daughter of the Hebrew Yuya, hence the mother of all genetically true Jews. Due to Akhenaton being half jew, the Egyptian priests  did not see him as the heir to the throne, hence a lot of problems arise in the Armana-period. We live in the middle of the cosmic drama that was set at this time, these happenings define our history today, and the old priesthood still exists in form of free masons and other secret brotherhoods. There is still today a conspiracy to hide the truth of what happened that time, it would destroy all religions and take the power from the today's moguls of the earth.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:24:21 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Further on all Pharaohs was rising after death, there was big ceremonies around this, with embalming and making mummies, taking care of the earthly body. The kings did travel to Osiris, and the Queens was traveling to Isis, this is depicted in the Pyramids from the 3. dynasty. So resurrection comes as well from Egyptian philosophy, and as the clever mind can see, they the Egyptians new about the soul, they knew they was dreaming this world, and the Pharaohs was the high priests of their respective "religions". After the King was dead, his heart was weighed against a feather (Anubis), symbolically for me meaning that if you have accepted that you are not physical, hence the heart is an illusion together with the feather, you will rise and become a star among the stars, or a God among the Gods. This is symbolically referring to the end of the incarnation circle. This was the ancient Egyptians symbolism around the knowledge, the inner knowledge mirrored in the world, heaven symbolizing our inner selves. Common people did not have the insight, but the priests many of them knew, hence they where magicians. The high priest is supposed to know, and the high priest was the Pharaoh, the incarnation of the God deity in question. Akhenaton blew all this symbolism away and got to the core, but it was to forceful. His Son Tutankhamen later reinstalled the old priesthood but continued his fathers religion, or rather insight about the one God, all that is, and their part in it. Tut, or Jesus then used the old Gods to spread his message, he officially used the Amun-God, the Sun-God as examples, and abolished his fathers Aton. Anyway the message from his father consisted which we can see from the findings in Tut`s tomb. Horemheb later destroyed the "religion" Akhenaton and Tut had founded, and he later put all the priest of the Amun-God out of work, and put his military friends in as priests. A big mistake I will say. This resulted in the domain of Seth in the 19.dynasty, and a complete opposite focus than what Jesus was hoping for. Instead of focus on the inside reality that had dominated Egyptian philosophy from its birth, know with the end of the royal line with Tut Ank Amon, and a overtake from military philosophy and thereafter Generals, the focus shifted to a physical an exterior focus. When we study the Egyptian history that is written in stone, and try to find similarities in the Bible, it is stunning, and a clear proof of plagiarizing not only the Egyptian history, but legends and myths from all over the world, to threw this manipulative maneuver collecting all believes and histories in to one single document. The Bible has been edited around year 300 and again in the 1500`s, not looking a bit like the original scriptures that existed 2000 years ago, where the dead sea scrolls being the smoking gun.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:28:26 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Me being newbie in the forum does not mean I am newbie in the Seth-material. I have a long history to tell to get to the point, there are marking choices in my life that makes the red line to make the long story short. I have read all books written from and about Carlos Castaneda. I was introduced to Castaneda first time around 20 years old, for it to reappear with full force when I was 35. Same time as Castaneda reappeared in my life, Seth came into my life as well, and that is 8 years ago. The last year I have deep dived into the Seth material for second time. About same time my interest for Egyptian history was re-awoken, being for me in the late 90`s a big subject, for then go sleeping for about 20 years, and the last time came back with full force.

It was a coincidence will many say that I suddenly got some information about Akhenaton that made me check him again 20 years later. Ironically will many say that the second title in YouTube was labeled Akhenaton and Moses. I was trying to say to myself that it was rubbish when the text insinuated that they being the same person. But my knowledge from 20 years earlier was waking up quickly, and I did that time see the similarities me thinking that Akhenaton predated Moses being the first mono religionist, yet this time 20 years later it fell like a bomb that we are talking about the same person. That made the ball rolling, and I am still deep in this hypnosis tracking our history and finding facts. The facts stated above is not mine to keep, I have to credit them to Ahmed Osman that have found the facts in old scriptures and with archeology, thus exposed the conspiracy that shadows the real story.

My benefit is that me having only one belief that is that me myself make my own world with my beliefs, have no problem believing everything Seth is telling us. There are some distortions in the translation Jane makes that is colored by her own belief system, that is as example that the man want to be Jesus that was drugged was crucified. He was killed yes, to make the prophecies true, and it all looks like the story about Osiris and the Egyptian God Seth again. The mummy of the supposed Pharaoh Tut shows a violent death, and this happened 3500 years ago, and Crucifixion was not the customs, the Romans had that as punishment 1500 years later. So I see coloring from Jane symbolizing his death as crucifixion, though that never happened.

When I investigate this story I in addition to scientists has the Seth quotation of what happened. Mainly that the 3 personalities lived same time in history, John coming first, then Jesus and last Paul. Mr Osman do not have the Seth-information, and can not use Seth`s words to put into the investigation, but I can. Thus is for me John the baptist the one that anointed/baptized Jesus, and that should be the high priest when that happened, happening to be Akhenaton, Semenkhare or possibly Ay. Due to Akhenaton`s obvious religious movement I put my finger on Akhenaton being John the Baptist, but that is my belief. Akhenaton also preceded his son Tut, and fits Seth`s words about this. Further on we have the Bible story about Paul, as well as Seth`s words about Paul, and put together with Egyptian history knowing that Paul was the last, and that they all lived at the same time, the finger points to Horemheb that historically fits Seth`s words about Paul`s personality at that time. There is no other person that fits the description. Mr. Osman does not state what I state, so the belief that John the baptist being Akhenaton, and St.Paul being Horemheb is my belief, the other settings is proved by Mr. Osman about the other biblical persons. For me it was important to implement the words of our Seth into the facts I have seen displayed.

“The internal dialogue is what grounds people in the daily world. The world is such and such or so and so, only because we talk to ourselves about its being such and such and so and so. The passageway into the world of shamans opens up after the warrior has learned to shut off his internal dialogue”
― Carlos Castaneda, The Wheel of Time: The Shamans of Mexico Their Thoughts About Life Death & the Universe
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:33:30 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Before the Armana-period we have the biblical David, named Thutmose III. The story tells that Abraham and Sarah went to Egypt, and Abraham told his wife Sarah not to tell in Egypt they where married, but tell they where brother and sister. She was according to the story very beautiful. There are various stories according to which scriptures we read, but the end of the story is that Pharaoh invites her in (Sarah), meaning at that time they would have sex, and she got pregnant with Pharaoh. Later on Pharaoh did get the information that she was already married, and adultery was forbidden that time. Hence Thutmose III (David) shipped Abraham back to Canaan with Sarah + a servant with promise that her heirs will inherit the land of Canaan. The Bible does not tell us that the baby Isak was the son of Pharaoh Thutmose III, but they display Abraham as the father of Isak, hence Abraham is the father of the Jews, but Mr. Osman has cleverly put the mental framework in the bible together from that time and decoded what the bible words really say when they are based on facts.

Isak was forbidden to come back to Egypt, but the promise was that later generations should come back to Egypt and be kings. Later on we have the story about Josef sold as a slave to Egypt, that later on becomes the most powerful man in Egypt after Pharaoh, historically identified as Yuya. As stated above Yuya appears around Amenhotep III (Salomon) and is the father of first wife of the Pharaoh named Tiye, mother of Akhenaton (Moses), and grandmother to King Tut (Jesus). So it is easy to see that the bible story is based on real happenings in Egypt under the 18. dynasty. So Josef (Yuya) is the one that brings the Hebrew blood into the Egyptian royal bloodline with his daughter, and 2 generations later it is all over and generals take over the show as Pharaohs and delete the Armana-kings from history. So what we today call genetically Jews linked to that history in blood is not only Hebrew, but also Egyptian bloodline (and Abraham`s sons does I am afraid not relate to this story other then him being the stepfather of Isak that he at one point wanted to kill, but have not he so nicely allowed the Pharaoh to have sex with his wife, this story would never be told). Jews only follow the mother line, hence the Egyptian history is blacked out. It is a fascinating story, specially when it is backed with evidence :) What is written in stone in Egypt and other places is difficult to deny.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:38:18 AM by Christer »

Offline Deb

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Christer, welcome to the forum!

I am traveling right now and get back late Monday night. You have posted a lot of very interesting information. You are very knowledgeable and I just don't have enough private time to read it all right now, although I have read some. Please be patient.


Offline Christer

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I have all the time in the universe :) Normally I only check the forums, but regarding this history I had to open my mouth because I have lots of facts around this story. And as stated Seth`s own words make me able to go further with the investigation.

I also want to state that our Seth has nothing to do with the Egyptian deity Seth, it is just a coincidence.

If you want to investigate my statements (not about my "beliefs" about who is Paul and John), you will need to read the literature from Ahmed Osman, that is the only way to get the information with all the sources, all explanations and so on. I have only given the short story, there is much more to it. As well as Osman, there is a engineer called Robert Bauval and a former journalist called Graham Hancock that also has fact based information about Egypt. F.ex the pyramids is not built by the Pharaohs, but by the Lumanians (my statement). All megalithic buildings are really from the Lumanians (still my statement). Seth states that we today walk in their towns, and he states that they knew the earth geography and the stars perfect. If you investigate the pyramids and the other super-old structures you will see a perfect perfection, the stones fit so perfect that you can not fit a razor blade between them, the walls are perfectly aligned with the north-south-west-east, the proportions are a map of  the earths own dimensions, the pyramids represent Orion`s belt on earth, and there are even chambers pointing to the star Osiris and Isis. Furthermore these buildings is impossible to build today, it is really not possible with only manpower, some of the stones are so big you can not imagine.

But the Lumanians used sound as mass-conveyer, they could build this easily. You also see a lot of megalithic structures in Asia Minor, and according to Seth the Lumanians at one time walked there basically. We also find a lot in South America, and even Easter Island.

Seth states that they made artificial food, so there is no meal evidences to find archeologically. They where also more in the spirit-world, than in the physical world, so you will find very little evidence of them, but there are quite a lot of unexplained objects found around the world. Using sound to move mass tells me how all this impossible objects firstly was modeled, and later sometimes moved or erected.

Strangely Seth in chapter 15 in Seth Speaks talks about talking about the 3 generation, but he never did (Rob states this in the end of the chapter, and it is correct). Rob thinks they forgot, but Seth never forgot, he always started where he left of (but not this time). This in itself is strange, but I think it was deliberate because some information we are to find our self, the teachers can not tell us what to do, or form our potential future (or maybe he did speak about it, namely us selves, by starting chapter 16 and the mental framework and our experiences. He says in the the end of chapter 15 that he will first say something more about the Lumanians, and next happening after that is Chapter 16. He did not say anything about chapter 16 being about the third civilization, but following the object in the latest part of chapter 15, the story about the 3. civilization should proceed, and what did proceed was chapter 16). Anyway the third generation is so called Atlantis. Lumanians came before the Atlantian`s. We only have Plato`s statement around 400BCE that Atlantis have existed. Me personally believe we are talking yet again about the -pre-Armana period more than 1000 years before Plato. You will not believe how much Gold was every-where. It got lost, and is connected with the Armana-period that ended it. Further on I have information telling me that in our time-line, Atlantis is in the future, so I think Atlantis was not reached, but it will be in our future and it is just a part of our dream world and we place it back in time. Atlantis is for me a state of being, it is a symbol of success. The Lumanians was walking the earth before Egyptian pharaohs, they also mixed with the other people, and as clean blood line died out

Further on when we bring astronomy in to the picture, we find evidence that the pyramids was built 10500 BC, and we find lots of these building around the world. The star map that the pyramids are point to 10.500 BC, that was supposedly when they where built. Anyway the heaven move not perfectly circular, but it wobbles, it is called precession. The star pictures in heaven is another place today then 12500 year ago. Meaning that the pyramids only 12500 year ago was aligned perfectly with the stars in the sign of Leo. We are now in the sign of Aquarius and far away from Leo. Eventually we will historically again come into Leo later on. The stars move 1 degree on the sky every 72 years, and in 25.920 years the full 360 degree is completed. Due to this all temples built with astronomy in mind is a calendar. The only problem here is that the scientist say it fits 12500 year ago, but it also fits 38.420 years ago and 64.340 years ago and so on. Only conclusion that is 100% fact is that the buildings are very old and represents a higher technology then what we can find with the Egyptians, Mayas, Incas, Toltec's and so on.

So for me I can see the rise of consciousness and the birth of the Ego in our history, where we went from being spiritual to take a full dive into physical reality, and surprisingly that is not so many thousands year back, around 5000-6000 years +- (and before we had the Lumanians. We as people now are the Atlantean people, but we have not reached the mental state yet, anyway not all off us. It is of utter importance which mental framework we are talking about. Archeology and history speaks to us, and when Seth is there behind in my back I have the best director to sort out evidence in the correct way (of course I do need to trust the Seth-material to be correct only with few distortions due to the translator Jane, but those errors I can spot). I do not care to much about details, I see them all as blind roads, but details is in the start needed to investigate the big picture, to get a feeling of it. As soon as the big picture is available, details do not matter, they go plastic. But anyway, I am a big fan of facts, and ironically all the important persons cracking the Egypt code is not Egyptologists, and that is important because they are not imprisoned in their religion and belief system. The Egytologists are as most experts, they are totally blind for information that do not fit the belief system, but luckily normal people are not bound to their religion, and many do see the logic presented from Osman, Bauval and Hancock. Hancock is the spiritual guy, he is really into Lumanians (though he do not know this name of them), though none of them know about Seth`s words. Many things they prove correct, and many other things they believe, but if they had the Seth story and also believed in it, they would make a giant step forward in my opinion.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:49:12 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Of course I also have to state that Akhenaton`s wife was none other than the famous Nefertiti, and wife of King Tut, in the Bible called Mary Magdalen, was Ankhesenamon. Also mother of Tut Nefertiti in the Bible is called Mary, there are lots of Mary`s because it is a title for the Queen translated in to Hebrew. It was in Egypt forbidden to talk about the Armana-royals after the end of the 18.dynasty, and i mean strictly forbidden.

The erasing of the Armana-royals from history, and the forbidding of talking about them is partly reason why the Bible words are like they are, not using their true names.

And I can not state this strong enough, Christ or Christos and so on means "the anointed one". All three Christ-figures was anointed when they where "baptized" as the new King. It was forbidden to call their names, so they was commonly known as Christ. Also fits with Seth`s statement that their history is blended into one person, and fictional persons was made around them. It is true that the Pharaoh as high priest had 12 other priests with him, called the priesthood.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:51:03 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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A very important information is that Akhenaton and Armana was not known to us before the late 1800`s when we found the remains and archeological proof of their existence. Onto this time all was myths. Later on in 1922 they found King Tut, and the ball was rolling faster and faster. So from the 19.dynasty until late 1800`s all was a tale about what happened, and of course it has changed in 3500 years. They where lost for 3300 years +, suddenly to reappear. This is built into our expectations, and it is important that the true story emerges to high-light our history and yet again for us to go the spiritual way. Paul will or has incarnated again, I see many signs, and I am one of the signs that arouses the expectations.

“To seek freedom is the only driving force I know. Freedom to fly off into that infinity out there. Freedom to dissolve; to lift off; to be like the flame of a candle, which, in spite of being up against the light of a billion stars, remains intact, because it never pretended to be more than what it is: a mere candle.”
― Carlos Castaneda, Don Juan: the Sorcerer
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 08:52:26 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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It is really a long story to tell, and I know all this because it is a life long interest and collecting of information.

I do follow the lead Seth gives me about one of the Christ personalities going to India he believes. More correct I think we talk about Kashmir, but that is my belief.

The following is my thinking's about this, and in any way not proof of what I am saying, but much of it is real facts.

To follow the evidence firstly, also taking Seth`s words about this into the investigation I have:

Paul was not satisfied in the end according to Seth, and according to history Horemheb as I believe is the biblical Paul died without children. His mummy is though never found, so there is no evidence in form of a body, but he had a long reign as King and most likely died in Egypt, according to the bible he was killed probably, but the story in the Bible can not be taken serious because it is placed in wrong time, 1500 years later. Paul is in my opinion a bad candidate for the one going to India. Though it is possible that he was killed by Ramses I, that later led to Moses coming back to Egypt to claim the throne back.

Jesus or King Tut as his real name is was supposedly killed, hanged, beheaded or crucified, but Seth tells about a conspiracy with the drugged want to be Jesus figure. We do have supposedly King Tut`s mummy, and we even do have the DNA-profile, as well as scanning profiles of what is inside the mummy, how the body looks, but we do not have DNA from other family members to my knowledge. Anyway the mummy could be either Tut or the drugged Jesus figure, we do not have conclusive evidence. Seth says that Mary are there because she feels sorry for the man, so it is not king Tut that is killed. Evidence from Osman says that he was killed by the wicked priest. And further on all this fits with the myth about Osiris and how he was killed, Osiris being identified with the Pharaoh Djer in the 1. dynasty and the myth around what happend when Seth killed him and cut his body into many parts, where Isis, Osiris wife, collected all the bits, made a phallos on the mummy and impregnated her self with the dead king and gave birth to Horus later, that became later the main deity. This was the prophecy that was going to be fulfilled, someone had to die. So possibly is the mummy of king Tut really the drugged Jesus figure, but I do not know, but there is a possibility that Jesus (King Tut) did not die and went to India and that everyone believes the mummy is the real Tut.

John the baptist is supposedly also killed, looks like same story as for Moses, and I believe Moses and John are the same, namely Akhenaton. Maybe the story is true that he was killed, the story supports it because Moses as many know went to Egypt directly into the palace and challenged the king named Ramses I. Nobody could stop him because he was clothed as the Pharaoh Akhenaton when he came back from exile, and no soldier could stop a God. He had the Pharaoh stick with him as the bible tells. What he was doing was to reclaim the throne after Horemheb died, he was in fact the right owner of the throne. But it did not go as expected, he was hated, so he had to flee, and possibly was later killed, but there are no evidence of this. So he is a contender in the Jesus for India story, but King Tut is my favorite.

There is a fourth contender named Semenkhare, but I know little of who this person is. I personally do maybe believe that it could be Nefertiti with name as a King. I know Akhenaton (from his art) was a loving person, that sat love to everything first, and that he as also Seth means there is no difference from man and woman, and he could do this as a statement just to say that my wife is equal to me (edited in later, due to thoughts catching my attention). If you look at how Akhenaton and Nefertiti look each other into the eyes, as well as kissing his baby, the message is obvious. King Tut did the same in his art with his wife, but he had no children living to our knowledge.

Further on there are stories about Jesus going to India in India, and even he went according to some stories to England and walked the land there being the source of the druids, but Seth is talking about the speakers in this regard. Anyway further on we have the story firstly about Krishna, who means the anointed one,  same as Christ. The mythological story about Krishna is the same as for Osiris and Jesus, where the basic story is the same. Same is to be said about Buddha, supposedly living 500 BC, but there are no proofs, only stories. The story about Buddha being a prince and so on is the same as the story of Jesus (according to the Thomas gospel Jesus saw all the poverty in the people, and that the people was that poverty (meaning mental poverty)), so what we do see is the same story in different clothing's, where only King Tut is an archeological fact, the other 2 not. The message from Krishna, Buddha, and Jesus are the same. The same as our Seth is telling us, or Carlos Castaneda that represents the same story in different clothing in America, another continent where Quetzalcoatl was the main deity. In "fact" Don Juan Matus and all the other sorceress in the story was reincarnation from the once historical Quetzalcoatl (the story goes that Don Juan Matus as the main character was the incarnation of Quetzalcoatl incarnating to fix the distortions inherited by the Toltec`s, all the other sorceress was personality fragments of the main Don Juan Matus, same as Seth tells about Jesus and the disciples, meaning they where one and the same materialized in same historical time, and they all disappeared when Castaneda training was ended and he had to finish it himself creatively, he did finish it with his books and the message, but he himself looks like ending up like a sex maniac that uses his power to seduce women and later dies of cancer, and his ministry has dissolved), where Don Juan was the teacher of Carlos Castaneda as the student (another spiritual play). The message is exactly the same as Seth. It is covered in metaphors and ancient American myths, many of them being the same as we find in Egypt, but Seth speaks in clear modern American language and try to avoid metaphors as best he can. There is a reason why Carlos Castaneda tells this story, because the mental corrupted inhabitants of south America would be pre-programmed to not see the real message. Castaneda though was naive and did not know what was about to happen, so he was free in his mind without judgments. Though he fell for Don Juan`s third enemy that is power,the first is fright, the second is insight, and the fourth is old age and the wish to retreat. Old he was not when he died, and books written from people near to him pictures a man possessed by power and his own self image as the Nagual, and this leaves us a message. And the message is that first of all that we are spiritual beings and if we understand that we form our own world with our focus-point, there is nothing to be afraid of. This opens the world insight and a clear mind, and when you use this correctly it is meant for you to throw away the picture you have as you self and that you are an entity that creates with the mind. When you finally understand this you will have power, you will as well have power to use others by manipulating the mental framework at a given time and given place, and if you succumb and are blinded to the power of manipulating reality and do so for your own benefits, than you will have lost to your third enemy power (what happened to Castaneda). But if you overcome this and use the power only to benefit all that is and you do it for the spirit, then you will have overcome your third enemy, and finally you will meet your last enemy that is old age. You will more and more wish to retreat back to your soul and surrender the world. You can never defeat old age, but you can hold it at bay so to speak, but finally you have to retreat.

I love the Castaneda-story, it is a deep part of me, and together with the Seth-material, Quantum-Physics, the ancients, personal experiences, they all form a bigger picture, it is the same story told in many many ways, due to that inner knowledge can not be translated in to words, we have to understand the meaning behind the words, the message they are carrying. Seth is the one of all of them that is most clear in his speech, he talk in our own symbolism so we can understand it, and he really tries due to Jane`s inability sometimes to translate the feeling tone correctly, meaning she colored the translation with her background as Catholic, she colored the story about the moon landing that Seth later states as a mental travel, as I with background in physics agree to, because the mental framework that mankind is locked inside does not allow us to travel to space, the physical laws put together forbid it. So society is based on many myths that is not true, but they are real as psychic structures and hence many peoples reality. This fact, as Seth himself stated, made a few distortions but not many. Jane had integrity and gave herself into it, but as with all of us, belief color our translation of inner knowledge, it is the subjective knowledge that is translated into physical reality as an objective translation of the subjective world (the inner self). Jane is to my knowledge the channeling person with the highest degree of integrity to my knowledge, she deliberately tried as much as she could to not blend her own Ego into the message coming from Seth. Seth states many times that it is difficult to tell things like mathematics because Jane had limited knowledge about that, and that insinuates that he had to use her consciousness to make the translation, he did not simply take over the body and used it, he had to work with it with Jane still present in the body. It is peculiar, and in itself a marvelous story :)

In the future there will come more evidence, more mummies will have their DNA-profile made, and in India there is a tomb where supposedly Jesus is buried, and if there is a mummy or body there we will in the future also find more evidence to maybe one time state the real facts. The way Jesus spoke, looks like the way Buddha and Krishna spoke, so I put my finger on King Tut traveling to India spreading the message with the wind :)
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 09:11:08 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Rather then destroying the picture many have of Jesus, the story Seth tells should point at the cosmic play involved. He is not the fable we can read about in the bible, he is part of a blessed entity, and the magnifying proportions Seth adds to what the core entity really did, should add immensely to the divinity of the whole. At the same time the statement is that we are all this divinity.

It is only understandable if one see it as the world and the universe is an idea construction as Seth says. It is a cosmic drama manifested in the physical world. The real story about who Jesus is tells us that he was a man, flesh and blood like all of us. There is no God other then his father the Pharaoh that made Mary pregnant, he himself willed himself into life and set the motion in play. Who he and his like are in regard to us selves, I would say they are like Seth, a personality entity that is more developed than us psychic, but we have the same potential, but need to end the incarnating circle, and that happens when we understand the message behind the spoken words, either it is Don Juan, Jesus, Krishna, Buddha, Seth or any other true messenger. According to the gospel of Thomas, Jesus says, anyone that understand the meaning of these words will not taste death. Seth says the same, he says that when you have understood with all yourself that you create your experience, than you are ready to go further on, and as Jesus said you will meet the kingdom of heaven.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 09:13:17 AM by Christer »

Offline Deb

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I'm still traveling. If you haven't come across this topic, it is the most popular one on the forum to date. https://speakingofseth.com/index.php?topic=669.0  The Return of the Christ Personality. Almost 23,000 views.

Offline Christer

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I find it ok to start in a quiet corner. As you know belief is tricky stuff, if I say something someone could be offended from, the ball will start rolling and I will stop commenting. I just want now slowly to spread the ideas so they can gain some momentum :) About the coming of Paul, I have no comments really, I do not know who he or she is, or if it is a physical birth at all, thogh Seth say it will be physical. What I can see, is that the mental framework is changing, and that the physical world is changing with it :)
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 09:14:32 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Here you have the Seth-quote that tells me he do not want to present us with the story in full "For several reasons, as mentioned by Rubert, I do not want to give any more detailed information as to the name that will be used, or the land of birth. "

As you all should now we talk about parallel universes, there are a numerous probable futures. You, me and everyone else has to choose the probable future we want to experience. My experience in a year or two could be another one than your own (the world picture), it all depends on what choices you make and I make. To say it in plain English, if you believe the same as I do, you will also experience the same as I, but colored with your own personality in your private life. We are now talking about the world as a whole with politics, religions and all, what we believe will happen.

The meek`s will inherit the earth, so the people that see peace and cooperation in the middle of chaos, they will be the ones that will inherit the earth.

So if you, me and many others believe from the core of the self that Paul will be re-born as another personality, it will happen. If we do not know if we should believe in it, it will not be recognized when it happens, and if we do not believe in the story it will not happen. In the line before we have 3 probable futures, and there are many more. Seth as any messenger is not allowed to manipulate the story, we have fully creative freedom, nobody demands us. So from an infinite probable events that could happen, each and everyone has to tune into them with their believes. Meaning we are in all probable futures, but the assemblage point as Castaneda named it, decides which information is seen with consciousness and recorded with the Ego. I myself live in all probable now`s as well as futures and pasts here and now,  and it is my focus point that decides what I experience and do see. Seth tells us the beliefs make the focus point, and that the focus point can be tracked by stalking your own thoughts, and it can be manipulated. It is in reality very easy to change beliefs when you understand what they are and what you are. It would be stupid then to believe that I will die from cancer or any other sickness. It would be stupid to believe that old age means me growing weak and have to look old. The beliefs in their selves will make it come true in my personal experience, so I had to rid myself with all beliefs that after investigation is marked as stupid beliefs, and all beliefs that benefits my experience, as well as all that is, is welcomed. Beliefs are like apps on the phone, some you can`t delete without being dead as human, as example the human shape, need for food, need for air, love and so on. Other apps has been installed later on in life, and can be deleted. When you realize that you are the God that installs or deletes the apps, then it is easy to do it.

Anyway, at this point in history, we are very closely in the mass-world that is materialized, we all know the story about Trump, me-too and so on, so we have all arrived to this meeting point in all that is. What we all do from this point on is individual, meaning we will all experience 7 billion versions of what is to happen, and many stories will be similar, but each experience is private inside the mass hallucination we all together create. You know, for most people in the world it does not exist the words Seth has made, they do not know anything about the Seth-story, so in their belief system they do not know when he will arrive or if he will.

So Seth with many others has aroused the expectations of Paul`s coming, I have a friend that died that told me the same story and many other stories, and he believed them fully. So if I can arouse the expectations further by presenting a story and evidence and beliefs, the idea and expectation will gain momentum, and it will brake out with full force.

So you see I believe he will come, in fact I am pretty sure other personalities that was part of the story at the time, later times and times before, has been incarnated to earth the last centuries, and Seth and Castaneda are not alone last 50 years, there are many. I do believe I has incarnations earlier related to the story, but I do not see other incarnations fully, only glimpses, so I do not with my Christer-Ego remember any other life at the moment, but regarding to my life history and what has happened to me it should be, for me anyway, obvious that I am connected some how to the story, and that does not mean I am directly connected to the 3 personalities. But I feel connected, so I am connected, and my mission is to find the connection story, and it helps with finding the truth behind it by seeking it, asking for it. It is said, ask and you will have the answers, so it is in reality only to ask the right questions to the self.

You get what you believe, it is as easy as that, and that is what we are to learn in physical reality, to manipulate our thoughts to be able to manifest our desires. An inevitable effect of understanding this is becoming a part of the kingdom of heaven. It is impossible to understand the depth of the words without understanding that you are all that is, yet a personality fragment experiencing itself, threw itself. So if you murder another person, you do in fact murder a part of yourself, hence turn the other cheek to the offender. As soon as you realize this, you will start taking responsibility for your thoughts, because their effect is obvious to you. In a metaphor, it looks like I am writing this to you, but in fact I write it to myself, because we are all one, and the self is all that is same time as it is itself (the Seth story about all layers in the onion being the whole onion, and yet a part of it). None is that way above or beneath, all parts is equally important. Often are people that is spiritually awaken of the meaning there is a hierarchy in the spiritual world with God on the top, and Seth and others below, and us at the near bottom. They also believe in demons and dark forces. They have not understood what they are, they do believe the Ego is what they are, and do not see the complexity of what the soul or God is. The soul is not something the Ego posses, the Ego is made from the soul, as well as the soul exists in multiple other universes and parallel worlds. So Seth is no greater then the spider, he is the spider, and the spider is him, and that is the kingdom of heaven.

I did die as personality when I was reading Seth. It was the mantra "you get what you believe" read for the thousand time, that merged with the Castaneda mantra "you get what you focus upon", and it snapped in my head and all beliefs fell at that moment. It was also an effect of changing beliefs over a long period of time, making me wake up in this world and I saw it for what it was, but even all new beliefs that I had made fell at the moment, I was belief-free for a short moment. There was only one belief left when I grasped life, and that is that you get what you believe, and then the task started to take responsibility for my beliefs and hence my thoughts. I know this has effect, I do see that mind creates matter, so for me there is no question what so ever of the authenticity of the Seth-material, or Castaneda-story, and the real Jesus-story, and hence Paul will be reborn (but not only he incarnates in this time, also many others related to the story, including me).

My real name is Christer, it is Scandinavian form of Christos in Greek, or Christian and so on. Many people are called the same name, people in my country, Greece, and all over the world. Funny is if you break down my name in to the sounds you will have Christ-er, the way you say it with a small pause between t and e. Translated to English this will be Christ-are, and that is the way I say my name in my Norwegian dialect. So it is for me funny that I have said all my life that Christ ar(e). In my language the i in Christ will be spoken with the English sound for e in place of i. I have never been Christian, I was baptized and was in the protocols as Christian, but I later when adult signed out of the Church, at that moment feeling Buddhism closest to truth. So spirituality has always been there, but I got it so forceful threw my mother, and with a strict earthly dad without spiritual thoughts, that I was placed as an observer in the middle asking my self all kind of questions. So it is for me evident that the story has had connection all my life, not threw Christianity, but by witnessing it threw my mothers strange spiritual world with the divine hierarchy, and then with biblical studies in school until 16 years old. Later on I met Buddhism, then Toltec wisdom, and last Seth and the real story of Jesus, and it all finally merged and made the big picture. This is for me a similar story to that Seth tells about he and a "friend" together forming the image of Allah and Moses to show the Muslim that they where one, then it is the same way for me in awaken life and not after death as with the Muslim in the story, but I have been presented the truth in so many ways, from all sorts of angels (angel as in measure here meaning view-points different angels watching the message, and not angels as in something biblical) that they finally merged as Allah and Moses did in the experience Seth tells about. This was the epiphany of the Muslim, mine has happened while awake in the physical world, so I know I will recognize death when it happens, and hence not taste death as Jesus spoke threw Thomas.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 09:29:49 AM by Christer »

Offline Deb

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Quote from: Christer
I find it ok to start in a quiet corner. As you know belief is tricky stuff, if I say something someone could be offended of, the ball will start rolling and I will stop commenting.

I get it. I just thought I'd point out that "Return" topic because there were a lot of ideas being tossed around that I thought you might find interesting. But certainly a lot to read. We had a couple of Seth 'experts' going back and forth and things did get stirred up eventually and there was a mess to clean up. It wasn't a pleasant experience because, as you say, beliefs are tricky stuff.

I had an opportunity to read most of your posts on my flight home last night (all except your last one). You present a lot of new ideas, much to look up, consider and absorb. I'll have to read all of them again for it all to sink in properly. I'm a little hesitant to just jump right in with comments because my brain likes to process things slowly in the background and I know very little about Egyptian history, Lumaria, and am definitely not educated Judaism and Christianity because of my inherent resistance to religion. Yet, what you say in your posts strangely makes a lot of sense to me and right now it feels right. Jesus being King Tut is a new concept for me, but you make a good case. Thank you also for pointing out which statements you make that are deductions/feelings/thoughts, but if you do have links to back up what you say about some things please don't hesitate to add citations. We're all about references here. Well, at least I am. :)

I don't know how much you've explored this forum, but some of the things you mentioned in this thread were discussed in different ways in other topics in this forum, so you are really connecting the dots, nicely filling in some blanks. At least for me. It's been an interesting past few weeks with some loose ends coming together.

So, I accept that the Christian biblical story of Jesus (and bible history in general) is a conglomeration of metaphors, myths and legends adopted from other spiritual or religious belief systems; repeated themes throughout spiritual history such as the virgin birth of a prophet/son of god, the crucifixion and rising from the dead, but you're really taking things to the next level with your tie-ins to Egyptian history, India, Buddha, Krishna, Don Juan/Castaneda.

Quote from: Christer
hence the second coming was psychic and not physical.

I'm still a little confused on the second coming of the Christ entity, because while at some times Seth states that there would be a second coming, I seem to recall him also saying that the second coming already took place so technically this will be a third coming for us. So the second physical coming for us? Sorry, I'm probably just splitting hairs at this point.

Part of me wonders why Seth had not brought up the Tut-Jesus connection, although I have not yet read ALL of the Seth books. And a little insider information: there are still a few unpublished sessions, transcripts, treasures out there. I'm personally attempting to assist in getting the unpublished things published (I am a graphic designer and have volunteered my services, have been involved in a few already). I do realize that Seth was trying to reveal information in an orderly fashion, not wanting to overwhelm Jane and Rob, wanting to present information to them when he felt they were ready to receive it. There is also the issue of Jane's religious background and her resistance to some of the information coming through, to the point that she would refuse to let Seth come through on certain things that bothered her.

Seth had proposed a 'future' book entirely devoted to Jesus and Christianity. He had also counted on Jane living much longer, to get more information channeled through her and into print. At least, it seems that was the original plan or agreement. Jane, in this reality, unfortunately chose an early exit. Probable realities being what they are, there are other realities (or at least one) where Jane continued to live and speak as Seth, so in some reality there is a book on Jesus, Christianity, and possibly the Tut connection.

I'm only getting started here. ;) I just wanted to get my feet wet. And I will read through your posts once again, and the latest one, which will probably prompt new insights for me.

On a personal note, I did peek ahead and saw that your name really is Christer, which caught my attention. My only child, male (he's 23 now) is named Christopher. I was tempted to name him Christian, but opted out for obvious reasons. In looking up Christopher, I see the Greek equivalent. Someone in my past offended me by referring to him as the Christ child. It never occurred to me at the time of his birth, but my last name begins with a T and so he is ChrisT. Unrelated, but funny nonetheless.


Offline Christer

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The second coming has not happened, the story that originated 2000 years ago was believed by the Christians to be the second coming, but it was a mental happening, not a physical one.

A Seth expert in my mind is not someone that has read everything many times and can quote any part of the material. A Seth expert is one that has implemented the belief system he is talking about, and hence has become what he is talking about. A person like that can say anything Seth says with his/her own words, because they are part of the mental furniture and understood. If you do not try to investigate the physical picture you are making, you as an ego will never understand how it originated.

So people can discuss as much as they want, I have yet to see any Seth-expert other then my dead friend. Even Jane did not totally understand the meaning of the words, if she did, she would not die and she would listen to Seth in the book The way towards health. But in our "reality" she choose not to go all the way, but in a parallel world she did you see. I am not much up for discussion if people do not give me blank facts. The facts I am stating is in the literature from Ahmed Osman and Robert Bauval together with the Seth-material. Seth gives it all another dimension, and give me the possibility to connect the dots in the physical picture. We are living in a cosmic drama, and we are connected to all human history, both physically and spiritually and in many incarnations at once. What happened in Egypt, happens now, and we are in the making of changing the past as we change our now, and also the possible future scenario!

The coming book about Christianity Seth will still make you see, because he set it all in motion. Seth is all that is, and I am also all that is, so when I am writing I speak on behalf of all that is. I, I and all the other I`s. So what I am talking about is the book that will be written, and Seth is a part of it because he is the root of the idea that connects the dots.

Seth could and would not intervene with our probable systems. Jane brought him into our system, but only thing he told about the future is the coming Paul. And the reason why he did was to arouse expectations, and because that story is part of all our probable futures. The story I am telling was at that point not part of all possible futures, but it was in at least one of them, and I have chosen this path. So we our selves are to make our world collectively, Seth is forbidden to intervene and choose the probable future for us, yet he became a part of it.

Jane was never the person to connect the dots with Egypt, we are many people that incarnates in this time to make things right. Ahmed Osman was the man that was supposed to connect the dots, and for me to pick them up and implement Seth into the investigation. I am confident that Ahmed Osman also has an incarnation from this time, hence he plugged into another self and could see what he saw, but he does not remember where the answers came from. There are yet many other people involved in unraveling the story, but me with my knowledge about Seth`s words can do more. I am about to unravel all the biblical myths, and place them in Egypt or other places on earth. Seth could also have told us that the moon-landing was a hoax and still is, he could have told us the lies about second world war and the reasons behind, he could have told us that the Lumanians built the Pyramids and many other fantastic buildings (not only that we walk in their towns), he could have told us about the perfect diet (which my dead friend was about to do later), he could have told us that the drama in Armana also has roots to freemasonry today (hence the same symbolism with Egyptian Gods, Obelisks, pyramids and rituals) and he could told us about the mix between Lumanians and other human races as happened in Egypt. Hence Egypt was quickly coming out of the tribe life, and into a magnificent society. But he did not, and he should also not, because we are to connect the dots ourselves. My dead friend remembered many incarnations, and also incarnations where I was part of it, but he never told me about them, because he said if he did I would not be able to find the truth, I would start imagining things. He never answered me at all if I asked what choice to make, because he understood that I am the choice-maker, how I form my life is my business.

Seth told us that the bible story never happened, and I have presented to you what really happened. There is a cosmic drama with some continuity. Me myself has experienced meeting a living teacher, and I am after his death to bring his message further on, and same time develop it. I am alone now, without his support, and I am happy he taught me integrity, for without integrity I would fail this miserably (speak the truth and nothing but the truth). I am also not allowed to tell people what to believe or what to choose, I am only a story teller that opens mental worlds not yet created by other ones. Ahmed Osman opened a mental world for me, and I am developing the idea further. The rest is up to the reader. Ask and you will have answers is spoken from Jesus or King Tut, and you do now get answers to questions you have focused upon, but with every answer there comes many more questions :) Anyway everyone has to implement new believes, and get rid of old ones themselves. That is what is the message behind the words if you understand the meaning of these words, you will not taste death and live eternally. Most people are stuck in the belief systems they are in, but Seth as he told did say what he did to make new psychological bridges to the reader. Only by considering what Seth tells, you will start mental processes that will live their own life, and hence belief conflicts will arise and the mental system will change. Seth did brilliantly, and it was his words that made me implement this belief system that I consider the only true belief.

We are about to wake up in this dream world and recognize it. When we do, we also understand our "pre-birth" choice, hence we do understand who we are and why we are here.

Seth also told you that you write the Seth-material as you read it, not symbolically, but literally. Same with my words, you write them as you read them, it is channeling and the physical reading is an subjective translation into the physical world, and the physical world is objective as you know, and the inner world is subjective. So we are dreaming this because we channel ourselves. We are all connected both physically and spiritually, and the dialog is in the subjective world (telepathy), and we translate it into objects as physical beings.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 10:22:26 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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The case is you see that I am not Christer, and still I am. I am the entity that has created Christer with my ideas, and I incarnated into the history that is Christer. So I as the entity experience myself threw Christer, but Christer is just a fragment of who I am. I am like Seth, and you too. You only are tricked to believe that the physical reality is real, but it is a objectifying illusion coming from the subjective inner self. When you dream mostly you loose your ego, but sometimes the ego wakes up in dreams, and when that happens you have a taste of how the subjective world functions. But as soon as the ego start to try to understand the dream, it vaporizes. You are at every moment translating your inner subjective world onto the physical picture. The thoughts comes before physical materialization. If you eat magic mushrooms or any other hallucinogens, they will brake down the mental wall that the ego has made against the inner world, and hence you will experience your beliefs/thoughts immediately, and you will call it a hallucination, but in fact you do see inner pictures objectified from your inner beliefs, and the stronger the focus-point, the more heavy the manifestation hits you. Traditionally these plants was used to learn you to find yourself, and they are good at that if you have a good guide while doing it, like Castaneda had. So on hallucinogens you are able to investigate your thought world, and hence find your beliefs if you do it the proper way. But it is not needed, one can find the way without.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 10:21:32 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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I have not yet quoted Seth, but I have used my own words that relates to Seth`s knowledge. I have quoted Castaneda in this land of Seth, and that is to give another view-point into the Seth world, because they really are saying the same in 2 different clothing.

"The internal dialogue is what grounds people in the daily world. The world is such and such or so and so, only because we talk to ourselves about its being such and such and so and so."


“I have no routines or personal history. One day I found out that they were no longer necessary for me and, like drinking, I dropped them. One must have the desire to drop them and then one must proceed harmoniously to chop them off, little by little. If you have no personal history, no explanations are needed; nobody is angry or disillusioned with your acts. And above all no one pins you down with their thoughts. It is best to erase all personal history because that makes us free from the encumbering thoughts of other people. I have, little by little, created a fog around me and my life. And now nobody knows for sure who I am or what I do. Not even I. How can I know who I am, when I am all this?”

“Self-importance is our greatest enemy. Think about it - what weakens us is feeling offended by the deeds and misdeeds of our fellowmen. Our self-importance requires that we spend most of our lives offended by someone.”

“Malicious acts are performed by people for personal gain … Sorcerers, though, have an ulterior purpose for their acts, which has nothing to do with personal gain. The fact that they enjoy their acts does not count as gain. Rather, it is a condition of their character. The average man acts only if there is a chance for profit. Warriors say they act not for profit but for the spirit.”

“We either make ourselves miserable or we make ourselves strong. The amount of work is the same”

“...that was the way human beings are; they love to be told what to do, but they love even more to fight and not do what they are told, and thus they get entangled in hating the one who told them in the first place.”

“We don’t need anyone to teach us sorcery, because there is really nothing to learn. What we need is a teacher to convince us that there is incalculable power at our fingertips. What a strange paradox!”

Offline Christer

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Assemblage point = Don Juan`s focus point, or what Seth puts down into words as being your thoughts, that originates from the beliefs.

Here you have a quotation of someone trying to say what Castaneda ment:

" In Castaneda's works, the term means a locus of perception within the energy field of a being.

Moving the assemblage point causes the being to perceive and interact with a different reality. This could be likened to tuning to a specific channel of reality. Castaneda describes the universe at large as consisting of filaments of energy. A being is an egg-shaped field of energy and some filaments pass through it and others do not. The filaments which intersect with the being are the sum total of realities accessible to the being.

All shape changing, travel between worlds and states of consciousness, etc. discussed by Castaneda derive from shifting the assemblage point. This can occur in a somewhat haphazard manner through the use of drugs but ultimately is something to be accomplished as an act of will.

The concept is specific to Castaneda. A somewhat corresponding concept in the Cassiopaea material is the notion of frequency resonance envelope or realm. Essentially all these concepts attempt to bring into words the relationship between consciousness and its external reality and the laws governing this reality. "

Offline Christer

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You see the ego, also mine earlier, could not imagine itself without the body. So when Castaneda changes into a crow, or jumps from a high cliff, only to shift his assemblage point in mid-air, or any sorcerer changing into any form, is the art of controlling the assemblage point. That is what Castaneda was to learn, and he did perfect.

Now I do see Christer and the body that is writing these words with its fingers as a psychic illusion, and then it is also not at all difficult to understand that shifting the assemblage point has nothing to do with carrying the physical body with it, one only jumps to another reality and identifies with it, as people do when they eat LSD. Some go crazy though, because their own belief system is in such a mess that they are far away from coping with the mental stress it provokes. If you believe in devils, LSD is a very bad choice, but if you do not believe in evil it can be pretty amazing. Anyway it all depends on the mental climate at the time one ingests such a thing. Seth says the same, I do only brake it down further into words what is really happening, and that is shifting of the assemblage point, with the ego still fully awake, and hence the beliefsystem of the ego is what the person will experience, and that is always the case.
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 12:39:04 PM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Go https://archive.org/stream/pdfy-56rRUG-ov0xn05ih/Jane%20Roberts%20-%20Seth%20Speaks_djvu.txt

push CTRL+F, and search for Chapter 15, there you will find the story about the Lumanians that I have fitted into my speach about our origin.

Also check chapter 17, there you will have a lot about the Christ-entity, as well as the birth of the ego and birth of the outward God

I can quote Seth on this one from chapter 17
"In your terms, by the time of Christ, the ego was sure enough of its position so that the projected picture of God could begin to change. "

And my favorite at this moment is "Now it is easier perhaps for some of you to understand the simple stories and parables of beginnings of which I have spoken. But the time has come for mankind to take several steps further, to expand the nature of his own consciousness by trying to comprehend a more profound version of reality. You have outgrown the time of children's tales." (late in chapter 14, before he starts telling about our origin).
« Last Edit: April 25, 2018, 10:45:07 AM by Christer »

Offline Christer

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Literature from Ahmed Osman is of big interest according to Egyptian and biblical history

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=ahmed+osman

Robert Bauval is the discoverer that the Pyramids are much older then supposed, and has proven that they are a picture of Orion`s belt with more, hence the Lumanian story

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_2?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=robert+bauval&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Arobert+bauval

Graham Hancock is the most spiritually official of the three, he openly advocates allowance of cannabis, and he is a profound speaker of  natural hallucinogens, and have tried them himself in South America in the form of ayahuasca, and I do understand his attraction to this regarding his mental framework. Good guy, and he should definitely have read the Seth material.

https://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss_1?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=graham+hancock&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Agraham+hancock

Please use a local book store to purchase these books ( or find the free way threw internet if you manage) I only use Amazon as a broad example, but companies like Amazon is a threat against family businesses, so the right choice is to support your local shop, keeping the money in circulation, not ending in tax paradises.

 

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