It seems that you are highly civilized people because

[inavalan]

your thoughts are reality. They directly affect your body. It seems that you are highly civilized people because you put your ill into hospitals where they can be cared for. What you do, of course, is to isolate a group of people who are filled with negative beliefs about illness. The contagion of beliefs spreads. Patients are obviously in hospitals because they are ill. The sick and their doctors both work on that principle.

[inavalan]

Generally speaking, those who advocate health foods or natural foods subscribe to some of the same overall beliefs held by your physicians.

They believe that diseases are the result of exterior conditions. Quite simply, their policy can be read: "You are what you eat." Some in this group also subscribe to philosophical ideas that somewhat moderate those concepts, recognizing the importance of the mind. Often though, some strong suggestions of a very negative character are given, so that all foods except certain accepted ones are seen as bad for the body, and the cause of diseases. People become afraid of the food they eat, and the field of eating then becomes the arena.

Moral values become attached to food, with some seen as good and some as bad. Symptoms appear, and are quite directly considered to be the natural result of ingesting foods on the forbidden list. In this system, at least, the body is not insulted with a bewildering assortment of drugs for therapy. It may, however, be starved of very needed nourishment.

Beyond that the whole problem of health and illness becomes simplistically applied, and here food is scrutinized. You are what you think, not what you eat — and to a large extent what you think about what you eat is far more important.

What you think about your body, health, and illness will determine how your food is used, and how your chemistry handles fats, for instance, or carbohydrates. Your attitudes in preparing meals are highly important.

[inavalan]

This is what happened with the covid!

The ill are gathered together and denied all of their normal and natural conditions, including the compensating motivations that alone would sometimes be enough to restore health if given time.

This isolation would be unfortunate enough without the application of drugs meant to help, but often given without understanding. Loved ones are permitted to visit the sick on but certain occasions, so those who wish them well in the strongest terms, who are closest to them and who love them, are efficiently prevented from exerting am natural constructive behavior.

(11:23.) For all practical purposes the ill are put into prison. They are forced to concentrate upon their condition. All of this applies quite apart from any other dehumanizing effects, such as overcrowded conditions, the denial of human privacy, and often the negation of dignity.

The individual is made to feel powerless, at the mercy of doctors or nurses who often do not have the time or energy to be personable, or to explain his [or her] condition in terms that he can understand. The patient is therefore forced to transfer his own sense of power to others, which further deepens his misery; this in turn reinforces the sense of powerlessness that initiated his condition.

Furthermore, the natural elements of sun, air, and earth are refused him. The stability of familiarity is withdrawn. Now with your set of beliefs you are indeed more or less obligated to go to hospitals in severe conditions. I am not saying here that many doctors and nurses do not try their best to promote healing, and certainly healings occur — but they do so despite the system and not because of it. In many cases the belief of a doctor in a person who is ill revives him and re-arouses his own belief in himself. The patient's confidence in the doctor will then reinforce the entire medical procedure, and he may then be filled with faith in his recovery. But as there are natural healing processes within animals, so there are in your race.

(11:32.) Illnesses usually represent unfaced problems, in your terms, and these dilemmas embody challenges meant to lead you to greater achievement and fulfillment. Because body and mind operate so well together, one will attempt to cure the other, and will often succeed if left alone. The organism has its own beliefs in health that are unconscious on your part.

[Deb]

This is what happened with the covid!

Boy no kidding. What's worse, with covid, the healthy were also isolated. Depending on where one lives, some more than others. The Chinese being nailed and boarded up in their apartments—I can only imagine what happened to them. Detainment camps in Australia. I also felt for people in nursing homes or assisted living here that were not allowed to have visitors. I have memories of loved ones standing outside of building windows trying to communicate with those isolated. Solitary confinement. Very damaging.

I've been noticing an increase in synchronicities in my life lately. Often it involves relevant things coming across my path in regards to topics here. Tonight I've been reading Rob's notes about Jane's medical issues in 1982. Almost unbearable to read, I feel for both of them. This stuck out for me:

A note: I told Dr. K something that Jane had said perhaps a week ago, and which I hadn't appreciated at the time: "I never felt sick until I went into the hospital." I was rather surprised when Dr. K looked at me in what seemed to be mutual understanding of this remark. Perhaps I'm misinterpreting her reaction, though.

I want to use Jane's statement in the Intro for Dreams. Dr. K did say that sooner or later Jane would have ended up in the hospital because of the thyroid – this after Jane expressed idea that she wished she hadn't entered hospital to begin with.

I might as well add these comments, since they came to mind when Frank Longwell dropped in at 11:30 AM while I was working on these notes. [He's still here at 12:00 noon.] I could hear Frank and Jane talking in the background, as I worked – and of course the conversation was mainly on Jane's physical condition, Dr. K., etc. I was suddenly struck by how thoroughly the medical aspect of our culture has invaded our lives, and been accepted by all concerned. What goes on? The whole business – I thought – is the very antithesis of what Jane and I are supposed to believe in. Yet all of our friends take it perfectly for granted that there is no other way of life. Everything they say and do reinforces these attitudes so thoroughly that if one isn't careful he or she could end up thinking that there is no other way of thinking – that medical beliefs and that way of life is a rock-bottom basic fact of existence, with no recourse. Like two and two make four, etc. Every person who sees us or calls us asks how Jane is doing, what the doctors say, what medicine she's taking, etc. – but none of them, with the occasional exception of Frank, who does possess a body of knowledge separate from this – ever seem to consider the possibility of living any other way...

[inavalan]

@Deb

Thanks for the quote. Quite revealing for their state of mind. On the other hand, the story (apparently) didn't end well. I'd really like to hear Seth's comments on what it went wrong (if it was wrong(?)).

Regarding (all) the covid measures ... When I think of the number of people who unnecessarily died (were killed), and of the amount of inflicted suffering (and I expect that we haven't seen its end yet), my verdict is: crimes against humanity.

On the other hand, I keep wondering why did I choose this thread of probabilities, what is the lesson that I have to get from it.

From the beginning, I rejected the idea of my getting vaccinated, for several reasons. Firstly because I never get flu vaccines, as I know that they are mostly ineffective and cause side effects. I had an idea about flu viruses' ease and speed of mutations, and about their creating of "antibody dependent enhancement of infection / disease". On the other hand I lead an above average healthy life style (I've been paying attention to it for over 20 years), so I believe I have a good immune system. We all aren't equal from this point of view. Why would I be as open to infection and disease as people who neglected their bodies? Then, all the scare and the hype were unhealthy, and obviously there were other interests involved (political especially).

In the spring of 2020, I consulted my inner source of knowledge and guidance, and I got that all the pandemic hype is the result of stupidity (to which I add incompetence and corruption).

I would like, from here on, to choose a probability where things turn up for better, and start again to make sense, where decent people get the upper hand, and the indecent people get the deserved feedback. I don't hate the latter. When I think of them, I pick one of the two analogies: having to deal with insolent kids, or encountering a turd on the road (my improvement of Zeland's pendulum concept). You can't think of hating either of them, and just deal with them accordingly.

Thanks again for the great quote!

[Deb]

I too trust my body's ability to maintain itself, my immune system is strong, I've never coddled it, and I tend to be kind to myself—meaning I don't create horrific situations for myself. If things don't go my way, I figure there's a good reason for that. A lesson to be learned. Seth helped corroborate that for me. I also question why I choose certain probabilities, especially those that are mass creations. While I'm not normally personally involved in these dramas, I do witness them and figure there's, again, a reason. I've always jokingly said that I'd prefer to learn from other's mistakes.

The pandemic was certainly a display of "something." I hope the majority learns something from it. I'm focused more on the people who "get it," and tend to move away from those who don't. I just figure I'm at the age where my BS tolerance is at its lowest.

As far as what went haywire with Jane, we're in good company wondering why. Jane and Rob speculated all the time Jane's reason for allowing what she suffered. I'm still reading Rob's notes, hard as it is to do. I made a list tonight of things Jane's body was dealing with and I'm flat out horrified at what she chose for herself. One illness would have been enough to end her life; for some reason she chose a mountain of problems.

Here are a couple more quotes from Rob's notes:

"Jane had cried a bit right after Dr. K. left and before Peggy came in, and I'd tried to console her. Now Jane burst into tears on the water bed: "I wish we'd tried harder with our own ideas..." Crying didn't last."

In the interviews I've read, people (and I think Rick Stack too) said that Jane and Rob were more interested in getting the materials out to the public, and less focused on using the knowledge for their own benefit. That quote speaks to that for me.

Also, several times Rob referred to Seth's saying people who don't chose to die, don't die. The hospital was telling Rob in 1982 that Jane would not make it. She held out two more years. Here's Rob:

So what is it, sweetheart, I thought as I put the car in the garage tonight, some kind of expiation because of your mother – because she was crippled and bedridden? Is that what this is all about – something we have to almost kill ourselves over before we can allow ourselves to recover, and begin to simply live from day to day? How dare we have any talent or ability under such circumstances of guilt, eh, how dare we even think we could enjoy such self-chosen gifts! Seth said once years ago that Jane had chosen her main role-thrusts in this life before birth, and that she had the strength to see them through. I'd have died had I known what my wife would decide upon ....

[inavalan]

...
I made a list tonight of things Jane's body was dealing with and I'm flat out horrified at what she chose for herself. One illness would have been enough to end her life; for some reason she chose a mountain of problems.
...
In the interviews I've read, people (and I think Rick Stack too) said that Jane and Rob were more interested in getting the materials out to the public, and less focused on using the knowledge for their own benefit. That quote speaks to that for me.
...

As many others, I am thankful to Seth, Jane and Rob for the material. Their work on it, in my opinion, shouldn't have prevented Jane and Rob from applying it to their lives, more than they did. I think it was a matter of not being able to overcome some of their beliefs.

In my experience with these things, you get inputs all the time, but you misunderstand or overlook them. Later, when you look back you recognize the signs, and reinterpret them. A flexible and unbiased attitude are crucial.

Regarding Ruburt's choice of what to experience as Jane ... As I understand these, Ruburt didn't choose the pain and the suffering at any point, neither before birth nor after. The pain and suffering resulted from Jane's beliefs, and from her oblivion to the lessons and the guidance she was provided all her life long. It wasn't anybody's fault: at the time that's what her personality was able to do. If anything, I'd say it was Seth's "fault" for not making things clearer, but his excuse is that he, and other teachers, can hep you only if you let them. Maybe it was just that Ruburt overestimated his abilities, and it may have been a lesson in humility.

I will help each of you according to the extent to which you allow me to help you—and therein, indeed, lies a mighty tale. There are others ready to help you—again, when you are ready to permit their aid.

Illnesses usually represent unfaced problems, in your terms, and these dilemmas embody challenges meant to lead you to greater achievement and fulfillment.

In my experience, you get a symbolic message meant to help you make a choice. If you ignore or misinterpret it, and make the wrong choice(s), you get stronger and stronger symbolic messages that restrict the range of choices you have, which usually is accompanied by some increasing pain and suffering. If later you look back, you can see it clearly (as long as you don't blame all kind of external factors). You can see that there was a meaning, and if you had understood the signs, you would had been spared the suffering.