No to mandatory vaccination

[Sena]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/52565764

[Deb]

As an adult I developed mixed feelings about vaccinations. When I was a kid I don't think there were many available at that point. All I remember were polio and tetanus, and kids were expected to catch measles, mumps and chicken pox and then be done with them. When my son was born, I got him the "required" but not mandated vaccines because the pediatrician scared me into them. I remember the physical reactions he had to them. Miserable. But if you don't get them, you're considered a negligent parent. And don't count on being able to get your child into any schools without an up-to-date vaccination record. Even his college required proof of up-to-date vaccinations.

"Today, the CDC recommends seventy-four doses of sixteen different vaccines from gestation to age eigh­teen; children receive the majority within the first six years of life, including the aluminum-containing hepatitis B vaccine at birth." from https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/ending-censorship-corruption-and-mandated-vaccination/

I've mentioned before, I'm just about convinced my son has type 1 diabetes because of the barrage of vaccines he had just before starting kindergarten. He was diagnosed 9 months later.

I'd heard over the years about some people being anti-vaxxers, but didn't get much information about why until I joined The Weston Price Foundation. A lot of their quarterly newsletters are devoted to revealing a lot of side effects and cover-ups surrounding vaccines. While many insist getting vaccinated is safe and the responsible thing to do (WHO in 2019, "the reluctance or refusal to vaccinate is among the top ten threats to global health "), in 1986 the US government passed the Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986, because... vaccines are safe?

People who refuse vaccines (or some medical procedures) based on their religion are generally excused here in the US. But in 2019 NY abolished the religious exemption (Orthodox Jews, Amish, Mennonite, maybe more).

https://www.westonaprice.org/health-topics/how-impersonal-vaccine-laws-play-out-in-real-life-new-yorks-repeal-of-the-religious-exemption/

In my own little free world, I feel herd immunity is the best way to go, and I believe in free will and personal freedoms. I also view things (viruses, mass events, pandemics) differently since I found the Seth materials. I'm wary of vaccines because I've read too much about them. I sure hope the US does not make Covid vaccines mandatory, especially since so many people are testing positive for antibodies.

The argument vaxxers have is that those not vaccinated are endangering "everyone else." I could never understand that logic, because if "everyone else" has had their vaccinations, they should already be immune, right?

[Sena]

People who refuse vaccines (or some medical procedures) based on their religion are generally excused here in the US.

Deb, there may be a case for claiming that we belong to the Sethian religion.

[LarryH]

The argument vaxxers have is that those not vaccinated are endangering "everyone else." I could never understand that logic, because if "everyone else" has had their vaccinations, they should already be immune, right?

It is expected that the vaccines will only provide about 50% immunity, similar to flu shots, so those who will be vaccinated will still be at risk.

In my own little free world, I feel herd immunity is the best way to go

In an article today, "Study: American public far from herd immunity" in the largest study yet looking for evidence of the disease in blood, about 9% of American adults have the antibody, while herd immunity requires 60-80%. Dr. George Rutherford, an epidemiologist and biostatistician at UC San Francisco said, "The only way we're going to get to herd immunity, unless you're in a very closed community like a prison, is for everybody to get vaccinated."

I will take the vaccine when I am convinced that it has not been rushed to market for political reasons and all protocols have been followed. Whatever negative side effects may be associated with a vaccine, they are likely to be far less damaging than what I might go through with the virus. I'm certainly not willing to take the chance that I and my loved ones will not be among the 60-80% who have to get the virus in order for herd immunity to be the solution.

[Sena]

In my own little free world, I feel herd immunity is the best way to go, and I believe in free will and personal freedoms.

Deb, with regard to herd immunity, there is an interesting article here:

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2666535220300306#sec12

"Allowing the COVID-19 pandemic to run its course uncontrolled must not be permitted. None of the responses of countries internationally are optimal as partly reflected in their variability.......Hope in natural forces, effective and safe vaccines and curative treatments is important but, given uncertainty, we need to consider other, admittedly difficult, paths. Adults should now reflect on and debate, together with their elected policymakers and scientific advisers, the balance of risks they accept for themselves, versus the risks imposed to wider society, and thus directly inform potential strategies. Covid-19 is having a major impact on children and their voice needs to be heard. Ageism must be avoided whether through shielding or workplace policies that might inadvertently cause harm. Everyone has the right to balance risks and benefits in relation to their own quality of life. This pandemic is complex while the messages being given to the public are overly simplistic."

[jbseth]

In my own little free world, I feel herd immunity is the best way to go, and I believe in free will and personal freedoms. I also view things (viruses, mass events, pandemics) differently since I found the Seth materials. I'm wary of vaccines because I've read too much about them. I sure hope the US does not make Covid vaccines mandatory, especially since so many people are testing positive for antibodies.

I will take the vaccine when I am convinced that it has not been rushed to market for political reasons and all protocols have been followed. Whatever negative side effects may be associated with a vaccine, they are likely to be far less damaging than what I might go through with the virus. I'm certainly not willing to take the chance that I and my loved ones will not be among the 60-80% who have to get the virus in order for herd immunity to be the solution.

Hi Deb, Hi LarryH, Hi Sena, Hi All,

We're all Seth readers here and because of this, I'm kind of curious about some of the comments that some of you've made above.  I'm trying to figure out if you actually believe some of these things that you've said. My thinking here is that, as Seth readers, "maybe" you didn't actually mean what you said. On the other hand, you may very well have meant what you said.  It's OK with me if you do, I'm just trying to figure out where you actually stand on some of these comments.


Deb,

In your statement above, you said:

"I'm wary of vaccines because I've read too much about them."

Do you really believe this?

Does this mean that you think that vaccines can actually harm you, without it being your consent to be harmed by them?




LarryH,

In your statement above, you said:

Whatever negative side effects may be associated with a vaccine, they are likely to be far less damaging than what I might go through with the virus.

Do you really believe this?

Does this mean that you believe that the side effects are likely to be less damaging than the virus? It sounds like a reasonable "belief", for someone to have, if they are plan to take the vaccine. But it also sounds like you "believe" that the virus, will be much worse than the vaccine. Is that really true?




LarryH,

In your statement above, you said:

I'm certainly not willing to take the "chance" that I and my loved ones will not be among the 60-80% who have to get the virus in order for herd immunity to be the solution.

Do you really believe this?

Does this mean that you think that there's an element of "chance" or that "chance" plays a factor in your life?


-jbseth

[LarryH]

LarryH,

In your statement above, you said:

Whatever negative side effects may be associated with a vaccine, they are likely to be far less damaging than what I might go through with the virus.

Do you really believe this?

Does this mean that you believe that the side effects are likely to be less damaging than the virus? It sounds like a reasonable "belief", for someone to have, if they are plan to take the vaccine. But it also sounds like you "believe" that the virus, will be much worse than the vaccine. Is that really true?

I will soon be 71, therefore in an age group at high risk for serious complications from the virus. Many people who get the virus have multiple long-term serious problems, assuming they survive. I have never had a problem with vaccines. Perhaps that is because I "believe" that they will not have an adverse effect on me. I also "believe" that I am unlikely to get the virus, but that is not a guarantee. I want to do what I can to hasten the time when I can once again engage in person-to-person contact with reduced risk that I could be a carrier. The sooner we achieve herd immunity (which I believe will only happen through the majority of the population getting vaccinated), the sooner society can get back to some kind of normal. I would be doing my part by respecting the beliefs of the majority. Seth said that if you believe in the medical establishment, you had better use it. However, I am alright with the vaccines being voluntary for most people. My guess is that they will at least be mandatory for the medical profession. When I was designing medical devices and had to visit hospitals as part of my job, even I had to be up-to-date with a variety of vaccines.

In your statement above, you said:

I'm certainly not willing to take the "chance" that I and my loved ones will not be among the 60-80% who have to get the virus in order for herd immunity to be the solution.

Do you really believe this?

Does this mean that you think that there's an element of "chance" or that "chance" plays a factor in your life?

This was in the context of achieving herd immunity without a vaccine, which would require 60-80% of the population to get the virus. Currently, about 9% of the U.S. population carries the antibody. Therefore, we would need 7X to 9X the number of cases up to now to achieve herd immunity. Clearly, this would increase the likelihood of getting the virus. At least 200 million Americans would have to "create" getting the virus. Call it chance, call it a logical statistical conclusion, but I don't see a way of getting around that. I have considerable control on the "chance" of me getting the virus, but I have less control of everyone I am close to and the 330,000,000 others who I don't know, and I would rather not see any of them go through what over 7 million have gone through in the U.S. so far. I would rather we learn our lessons in a less painful way.

The "chance" that I will get hit by a car is virtually nil. And yet I still look both ways before crossing the street.

[Sena]

I will soon be 71, therefore in an age group at high risk for serious complications from the virus.

Larry, welcome to the 71 club. I am the same age, and I also suffer from asthma. I am pretty sure that I had the virus in March, although tests were not available then. It was an unpleasant illness, but not as bad as the flu I had some years ago.

Why didn't I die in March? It is because my Inner Self had not decided to die at that time. It seems to me that you disagree with a fundamental Seth concept. You believe that the virus causes death, and that the Inner Self has no say in the matter.

"I am speaking generally here, for remember that your individual beliefs, thoughts, and emotions cause your reality, so no person dies ahead of his or her time. The individual chooses the time of death. It is true, however, that many cancers and conditions such as AIDS result because the immunity system has been so tampered with that the body has not been allowed to follow through with its own balancing procedures.

Again, however, no individual dies of cancer or AIDS, or any other condition, until they themselves have set the time."

—WTH Chapter 6: April 25, 1984

"The day of death is known. Consciously such knowledge is not given to the ego for obvious reasons, but every organism, through its inner senses, is equipped with subconscious knowledge of personal disasters, deaths, and so forth, the personality itself deciding beforehand what it considers disastrous; and the members of the species as a whole know in advance of their wars." (from "The Early Sessions: Book 2 of The Seth Material" by Jane Roberts, Robert Butts)

https://amzn.eu/0xAJg5F

[jbseth]

Hi LarryH, Hi All,

Thanks for your reply LarryH.

First of all, let me just say that I'll soon be 66 and so I get the high risk age group concept with COVID-19. However, that being said, my beliefs about this may be different than yours.

I'm beginning to think that there really may be something to what Seth says about "counterparts". I think that, on some level, we're all counterparts of each other. Each one of us, in expressing who we are, via our various ideas and beliefs, are some of the various expressions of "All That Is", so that "All That Is" can come to know itself. That being the case, none of us would or should have the exact same ideas and beliefs about everything.



You pointed out that Seth said something to the effect that as long as you believe in the medical establishment, you had better use it. You are absolutely correct about this, and I think he's probably correct about this statement. Those people who do believe in it, should use it.

While this statement did at one time, describe me as well, it doesn't describe me so much anymore. For myself, I've come across too many other stories that puts some major chinks in the armor of the beliefs that are held by the medical establishment.

These include the story told by the psychologist Bruno Klopfer about a man named Mr. Wright who had advanced lymph node cancer and Krebiozen. As the story goes, Mr. Wright "believed" that this treatment Krebiozen, would work and shortly after getting a treatment he became cancer free. Then he heard that it didn't work, and his cancer came back. After this, his psychologist convinced Mr. Wright that the stories weren't true for his situation and Mr. Write improved again. Then, the AMA announced that Krebiozen was worthless and Mr. Wright's cancer returned, blossomed and he died of cancer. This story is in Chapter 4 of, "The Holographic Universe".

Along with this, also located in Chapter 4 of, "The Holographic Universe" is the story of the person with multiple personalities, who had multiple personalities who were allergic to orange juice, (these personalities would break out in a rash if they drank OJ) but one personality didn't (that personality could drink OK and not get the rash). There is also an incredible story in this same chapter about a person with multiple personalities who was stung by a wasp. In regards to this, way back in May of 1966, in TES6, S256, (page 135) Seth says that the reason that this type of thing occurs is because, each personality has a completely different physical body. The bodies look nearly identical but are, in fact, different. This explanation, as incredible as it is, seems very plausible to me when I think about it.

Then, along with these types of stories, there's the incredible story told in the book, "Dying to be Me" by Anita Moorjani. This is the story of her experiences with extreme late stage cancer, a NDE experience while on her deathbed, and then a full recovery from cancer including a complete remission. 

It is these types of stories that suggest to me that, at least for some people, call it what you want, belief, faith, the placebo effect, or whatever, they seem to have some ability to affect their health, largely by their beliefs. To some degree, this is more or less what Seth says about beliefs and health. The medical establishment, as a general rule, does not acknowledge this. At least partly because it doesn't match their established beliefs about disease and how it works.


You also quoted some ideas that I personally think might be "beliefs" and as such, may or may not necessarily be "true", such as:

- Herd mentality would require 60-80% of the population to get the virus.
- Currently, about 9% of the U.S. population carries the antibody.
- Therefore, we would need 7X to 9X the number of cases up to achieve herd immunity.
- Clearly, this would increase the likelihood of getting the virus.
- At least 200 million Americans would have to "create" getting the virus.
- Call it chance, call it a logical statistical conclusion, but I don't see a way of getting around that.

But again, this is just my perspective on things.


Along with this, you also stated the following:

I have considerable control on the "chance" of me getting the virus, but I have less control of everyone I am close to and the 330,000,000 others who I don't know, and I would rather not see any of them go through what over 7 million have gone through in the U.S. so far.

So far this year, in January, my sister died of cancer and then in April, my brother died of dementia. In talking about this, I'm not looking for sympathy here, but I have come to the realization, that I really don't have much of control over what others are going to choose for themselves. I didn't want either one of them to die this year, but that was their path and not my choice.

If it turns out that over the next 5 years, 3 billion people, here on earth choose to die of Covid-19, do you really think that there is anything you can do to stop that?   

I'm not sure that I can, if that is what people are going to choose for themselves. On the other hand, perhaps we can choose a different probable future by placing our belief in one where that doesn't occur.


Finally, you said:

The "chance" that I will get hit by a car is virtually nil. And yet I still look both ways before crossing the street.

Yes. I understand this. For me, on the cul-de-sac where I live, the chance of me getting hit by a car, if I didn't stop and look both ways first, is also virtually nil. However, there is a four lane road with very heavy traffic on it some of the time about a mile away from where I live. I would also say that depending upon the time of day, the chance of me getting hit by a car on that road, if I didn't stop and look both ways first, is probably pretty close to 100%.

I also understand that gravity is a root assumption for this physical universe. If I chose to step out of the window, on the tenth floor of a building, all of the "belief" that I can muster, probably isn't going to do much to prevent me from falling to my death.

On a personal path, I'm still working on the issue of how and where and when to apply Seth's various concepts to my life. Thank you for giving me this opportunity to share.

-jbseth

[LarryH]

I am pretty sure that I had the virus in March, although tests were not available then. It was an unpleasant illness, but not as bad as the flu I had some years ago.

I know someone who was certain that he had the virus around the same time, but he later tested negative for the antibody.

Why didn't I die in March? It is because my Inner Self had not decided to die at that time. It seems to me that you disagree with a fundamental Seth concept. You believe that the virus causes death, and that the Inner Self has no say in the matter.

I am far less concerned about dying than I am about the potential for a slew of horrible medical problems for months, if not years, whether or not they lead to death. I am also far less concerned for myself than for my loved ones.

You also quoted some ideas that I personally think might be "beliefs" and as such, may or may not necessarily be "true"

Yes, I quoted some scientific data that I trust more than my ability to "believe" otherwise. I choose to trust scientists and medical professionals more than politicians who denigrate them. That being said, I also absolutely believe in those examples that you cited of spontaneous remissions, etc. I do not claim that the medical profession or science are infallible or that we need to place all of our trust in them.

Now, consider the art of ritual. Is it the ritual that creates the magic, or is the ritual a form of autosuggestion, thus a form of self-empowerment? I consider getting a vaccine as a ritual on behalf of maintaining health. I suggest that if one believes that a vaccine will be more harmful than not getting vaccinated, then you had better not get vaccinated. You would be setting yourself up for all manner of side effects.

If it turns out that over the next 5 years, 3 billion people, here on earth choose to die of Covid-19, do you really think that there is anything you can do to stop that? 

I can choose a reality in which that does not happen if I believe Seth. But that is inner work. There is also outer work, playing in the sandbox of physical reality. In outer work, my influence is highly limited. Of course, I cannot change the choices of 3 billion people, nor have I said that I could. I'm just pushing the sand around in my little corner of the sandbox, playing with you and my other playmates, pretending that there's something serious going on and debating what we should do about it. 

[Sena]

I am far less concerned about dying than I am about the potential for a slew of horrible medical problems for months, if not years, whether or not they lead to death. I am also far less concerned for myself than for my loved ones.

Larry, my understanding of Seth is that the same principle applies whether it is death or a "horrible medical condition". It won't happen unless your Inner Self agrees to it. I can understand your concern for your loved ones. They each have an Inner Self looking out for them.

[Sena]

So far this year, in January, my sister died of cancer and then in April, my brother died of dementia. In talking about this, I'm not looking for sympathy here, but I have come to the realization, that I really don't have much of control over what others are going to choose for themselves. I didn't want either one of them to die this year, but that was their path and not my choice.

jbseth, that is an important realization that you have come to. My understanding of Seth is that although the death of an individual is painful for the relatives and friends, for the person who dies, death is no big deal. It is just a step on the spiritual path.

"There is no separate, indivisible, specific point of death. Life is a state of becoming, and death is a part of this process of becoming. You are alive now, a consciousness knowing itself, sparkling with cognition amid a debris of dead and dying cells; alive while the atoms and molecules of your body die and are reborn. You are alive, therefore, in the midst of small deaths; portions of your own image crumble away moment by moment and are replaced, and you scarcely give the matter a thought. So you are to some extent now alive in the midst of the death of yourself — alive despite, and yet because of, the multitudinous deaths and rebirths that occur within your body in physical terms." (from "Seth Speaks: The Eternal Validity of the Soul (A Seth Book)" by Jane Roberts)

https://amzn.eu/evgaYFZ

"Birth and death then have their function, intensifying and focusing your attention. Life seems more dear in your terms, corporeal terms, because of the existence of death. It seems, perhaps, easier to have no conscious idea of the year or time that death might occur. Unconsciously of course each man and woman knows, and yet hides the knowledge." (from "The Nature of Personal Reality: Specific, Practical Techniques for Solving Everyday Problems and Enriching the Life You Know (A Seth Book)" by Jane Roberts)

https://amzn.eu/guD2Yxq

[LarryH]

How is fear of a vaccination different from fear of a pandemic? As Seth readers, are we supposed to feel safe from a pandemic but not safe from a vaccination?

If I should choose to forego vaccination and then become a carrier without symptoms and infect a loved one, do I have an excuse to not feel a pang of guilt because that loved one "chose" to get the virus?

If I leave a loaded gun on the coffee table for a child to find and play with, and that child accidently shoots herself, Oh, well, I guess she "chose" to die. How Sethian. My point here is that part of the equation is that we have a responsibility in the physical world over and above Sethian concepts where "time doesn't exist", "there is no cause and effect", "nobody dies who does not want to die", etc. We are playing in a sandbox where we pretend that rocks are hard, water is wet, the laws of physics are real, we get in trouble if we are late for work ("But boss, time doesn't exist!"). If anyone here is applying Sethian concepts fully and consistently, let them throw the first illusionary stone.

[Sena]

How Sethian. My point here is that part of the equation is that we have a responsibility in the physical world over and above Sethian concepts where "time doesn't exist", "there is no cause and effect", "nobody dies who does not want to die", etc.

Larry, may I ask what aspects of the Seth teaching you agree with?

[jbseth]

If I leave a loaded gun on the coffee table for a child to find and play with, and that child accidently shoots herself, Oh, well, I guess she "chose" to die. How Sethian.

Hi LarryH, Hi All,

Over the years, I've heard several people say something like this and it always amazes me as to how or why they come to this conclusion.  From my perspective, I don't believe that Seth ever intended that his messages be interpreted this way. I also think that he would have been very disappointed, (if it was possible to make Seth disappointed) both in himself in his failure to clarify this point as a teacher, and in those people who chose to interpret his teachings in this way.


Yes, I do think that a female child will pick up a loaded gun left there by her parent, and kill herself in some situations. Unfortunately this does happen on occasion. From Seth's perspective I interpret what he has to say about this kind of thing as follows. There are no accidents. This is a situation where the child agreed to give her parent a valuable lesson having to do with "responsibly".

Never, however, did he seem to suggest that it was OK for people to have a cavalier belief about situations like this, in terms of, "Oh well, she chose to die".


In fact, it's interesting that you chose to use this specific example because in TES9, S452, Seth says the following:

"You do not give a child a loaded gun if you are certain he is going to shoot himself or his neighbor."

https://findingseth.com/q/session:452+child/

Thus, here he seems to be suggesting that people NOT do this.




Then, along with this, in TES7, immediately after session 303, there is a section titled, Gene Asks About Past Lives.  In this section, Seth and Dr. Gene Bernard are philosophically debating Eastern Religious ideas. In this debate Dr. Bernard seems to be indicating that life is just all an illusion, what does anything matter. In response to this, Seth seems to be countering that life does matter or at least it behooves us to understand what it is that's important. Here's the ending of that dialogue between Gene and Seth.


You are indeed now playing a game with yourself, but it is not relevant, and it may be irrelevant. But you had better play it reverently.

([Gene]: "With reverence for whom?")

With reverence indeed toward the self.

([Gene]: "With reverence for whom?")

There is a holy irreverence and a flighty irreverence. You are playing a game. They are both one. But you had better be certain that you know this thoroughly. Now I suggest you rest.



Finally, Seth often talks about "value fulfillment". In UR1, S697, Seth seems to be implying that our value fulfillment may be somewhat dependent upon mankind helping each other out, when we can achieve the type of brotherhood that is possessed by the cells.  Here's what he says.

Sorry but you must log in to view spoiler contents.

It seems to me that these ideas from Seth are very inconsistent with the cavalier belief about a child who accidently kills herself with a loaded gun I left on a coffee table.  A belief of, "Oh, well, I guess she "chose" to die. 

To me, that belief is definitely not anything that is "Sethian".


-jbseth

[jbseth]

How is fear of a vaccination different from fear of a pandemic? As Seth readers, are we supposed to feel safe from a pandemic but not safe from a vaccination?

If I should choose to forego vaccination and then become a carrier without symptoms and infect a loved one, do I have an excuse to not feel a pang of guilt because that loved one "chose" to get the virus?

If I leave a loaded gun on the coffee table for a child to find and play with, and that child accidently shoots herself, Oh, well, I guess she "chose" to die. How Sethian. My point here is that part of the equation is that we have a responsibility in the physical world over and above Sethian concepts where "time doesn't exist", "there is no cause and effect", "nobody dies who does not want to die", etc. We are playing in a sandbox where we pretend that rocks are hard, water is wet, the laws of physics are real, we get in trouble if we are late for work ("But boss, time doesn't exist!"). If anyone here is applying Sethian concepts fully and consistently, let them throw the first illusionary stone.

Hi LarryH, Hi All,

Those are legitimate comments so, let's talk about them.



How is fear of a vaccination different from fear of a pandemic?

I don't think it is. Fear if fear. If you dwell on fearful things you can create them in your reality.



As Seth readers, are we supposed to feel safe from a pandemic but not safe from a vaccination?

I don't think that Seth ever said that.



If I should choose to forego vaccination and then become a carrier without symptoms and infect a loved one, do I have an excuse to not feel a pang of guilt because that loved one "chose" to get the virus?

First of all, how would you even know whether you were a carrier without symptoms?

Then, even if you did somehow determine that you were a carrier, wouldn't you then tell your loved ones about this, so that they could do what's necessary for themselves to minimize the risk until the condition / risk somehow changed for you and them.

Next, let's say that one or more of your loved one's live with you, and they haven't been either vaccinated and they also haven't had the virus.  After you find out that you are a carrier, and communicate with them about this, then the decision is between you and them about what to do that is the best for all involved. There are probably at least several options here, some of which may involve one or more of you taking some sort of risk.

If the risks are known by all, and people opt to live with you knowing that they are at risk, then that is their choice in the matter.

Finally, let's say that one of them got the virus. How would you know for certain that they got it from you?  They may have decided to get this virus, on their own, and chose to do so by activating the virus that existed within their very own body.  How would anyone ever know for certain that this didn't happen instead? Seth does say that we all contain, all the viruses inside of us.



"do I have an "excuse" to not feel a pang of "guilt" because that loved one "chose" to get the virus?"

Do you need an "excuse" to not feel a pang of "guilt" because that loved one "chose" to create their reality and get the virus?


We are playing in a sandbox where we pretend that rocks are hard, water is wet, the laws of physics are real, we get in trouble if we are late for work ("But boss, time doesn't exist!"). If anyone here is applying Sethian concepts fully and consistently, let them throw the first illusionary stone.

Yes we are, I completely agree. Along with this, we are also playing in a sand box where our beliefs can limit us from greater experiences, where synchronistic events occur all the time, where psychics like John Edward, Judith Orloff and Allison DuBios and Ingo Swann, seem to have some capabilities that science claims either can't or doesn't exist. We are playing in a sandbox, where Seth came along and gave us some pretty amazing concepts and ideas like "you create your reality" and "the point of power is in the present" and many of us are trying to figure out just where and how these concepts can and do apply to our world. We are playing in a sand box where some of our previously held beliefs about things, may not, in fact, be valid.

-jbseth

[LarryH]

Larry, may I ask what aspects of the Seth teaching you agree with?

Far easier to say what aspects I do not agree with, or to put it more precisely, what aspects I question. Very few, in fact the only teachings I can think of off-hand are those discussed in this thread. Even those, I fundamentally feel that there is truth. We know that, as Seth has said, there can be distortion in the material. We also know that Jane mistrusted the medical establishment. That is enough to allow a little questioning. I believe that you have challenged other Seth teachings, so maybe we are about at the same level of acceptance, just different topics.

[LarryH]

Quote from: LarryH
If I leave a loaded gun on the coffee table for a child to find and play with, and that child accidently shoots herself, Oh, well, I guess she "chose" to die. How Sethian.

Hi LarryH, Hi All,

Over the years, I've heard several people say something like this and it always amazes me as to how or why they come to this conclusion.  From my perspective, I don't believe that Seth ever intended that his messages be interpreted this way.

I was being sarcastic. I don't believe for a moment that such an event calls for such a cavalier attitude, just as I don't believe that peoples' personal behavior regarding the pandemic does not matter because of a belief that it's peoples' choice to die or suffer with the virus. It's not that this is not true. It's that it's not an excuse to do what we can to end the pandemic. We all want the world's economies to recover. In order for that to happen, we need to achieve herd immunity. I happen to believe that the fastest, least dangerous way to do that is via vaccines. If enough people do not get the vaccine because they think it is dangerous, they may be delaying herd immunity and thus the world's economies.

[LarryH]

"As Seth readers, are we supposed to feel safe from a pandemic but not safe from a vaccination?"

I don't think that Seth ever said that.

Lynda Dahl, based on Seth's teachings, wrote 'We Live in a Safe Universe'. Seth spoke negatively about vaccines. It seems like a contradiction to me. I am not afraid of vaccinations. It seems that many Seth readers are.

[LarryH]

First of all, how would you even know whether you were a carrier without symptoms?

Maybe I have to get tested for my job and test positive. I'm not going to answer all of your questions. You are picking fly shit out of the pepper just to try to delegitimize my point. Suffice it to say that the scenario that I described is possible.

Seth does say that we all contain, all the viruses inside of us.

I seriously doubt that Covid-19 is in all of us. It might be true for common viruses, but I really question Seth on that "all" viruses?

[jbseth]

I'm not going to answer all of your questions. You are picking fly shit out of the pepper just to try to delegitimize my point.

Hi LarryH, Hi All,

I didn't expect you to answer all of my comments. Nor was I trying to delegitimize your point.  I was only trying to point out some of the thoughts I had about your comment. I wasn't sure if I was on the right track, or if perhaps you meant something else.

Peace. I meant no offense. 

-jbseth

[Sena]

Along with this, we are also playing in a sand box where our beliefs can limit us from greater experiences, where synchronistic events occur all the time, where psychics like John Edward, Judith Orloff and Allison DuBios and Ingo Swann, seem to have some capabilities that science claims either can't or doesn't exist.

jbseth, that is a great analogy, "playing in a sand box". What that implies for me is that we should not take Covid 19 too seriously. I am familiar with Ingo Swann, but not the others. I'll look them up. Would you add Sylvia Browne to the list?


Ingo Swann on "fear":

"Fear has always played an over-large role throughout written human history, and in pre-
history, too, throughout which fear-sagas were forwarded via oral traditions in all cultures.
It is therefore surprising that the topic of fear, as a major human component of our species
entire, has not been given much philosophical consideration. At least there is no major entry for it in
the otherwise all-inclusive ENCYCLOPEDIA OF PHILOSOPHY (in eight volumes) published in
1967, edited by Paul Edwards, and which covers some 2,000 years of philosophical discourse. Fear
is mentioned only twice in the Index – in association with death and tragedy.
This considerable omission, one can suppose, is more than just mysterious, being neigh on
inexplicable. After all, it is quite obvious that FEAR, or fear of it, has always constituted one of the
major "drives" of the collective consciousness of our species – as well as our collective
unconscious."

The remarks about fear are relevant because it helps us understand why many people are affected by fear regarding Covid 19, and are irrational about it.

Seth on fear:

"The immobility showed itself physically in faithful replica to the inner immobilization caused by fear. You could see, in other words, the exact extent of the distortion in quite physical terms."

"This response to fear is a danger to psychic work, where freedom is necessary. In projections most of all the self must be mobile. Rapidity of perception, mobility of consciousness, openness of emotional response, are prerequisites for our work. The fearful spirit fears to leave the body, and fears to reside in it also. Ruburt has my congratulations, for he has now successfully passed a period of trial."
—TES7 Session 297 October 26, 1966

[LarryH]

https://www.unknowncountry.com/headline-news/scientists-developing-a-vaccine-that-spreads-like-a-virus-what-could-go-wrong/

[Sena]

https://www.unknowncountry.com/headline-news/scientists-developing-a-vaccine-that-spreads-like-a-virus-what-could-go-wrong/

"However, the researchers admit a virus used to transmit a vaccine could evolve back to its original harmful state and thus cause "unintended" consequences."

https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1340352/coronavirus-vaccine-covid19-self-spreading-vaccine

"Two staff members at a hospital in India who tested positive for the new coronavirus became reinfected several months later — and had no symptoms in either instance.

The hospital employees, a 25-year-old-man and a 28-year-old woman, worked in the COVID-19 ward. Both tested positive for SARS-CoV-2 in May, although neither had symptoms (V. Gupta et al. Clin. Inf. Dis. https://doi.org/d97d; 2020). After testing negative, they returned to work. Both tested positive again roughly three-and-a-half months after the first positive test. Neither had symptoms, but both had higher levels of virus than in May."

"The results suggest that asymptomatic reinfections are often underreported, the authors say."

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-00502-w

[jbseth]

I am familiar with Ingo Swann, but not the others. I'll look them up. Would you add Sylvia Browne to the list?

Hi Sena, Hi All,

In this list, I was trying to include the names of people who have seemingly demonstrated, in one way or another, some sort of legitimate psychic gift. As I'm thinking about this now, I also could have added Jane Roberts and, in my opinion, Sue Watkins, (Jane's friend) to this list.

You noticed that Sylvia Browne's name was not on this list.  That was intentional; I'm not sure about her.

I'm familiar with Ingo Swann's name, from several "Remote Viewing" books that I've read. I know that there were also several other people, having to do with remote viewing that also seemed to have demonstrated a psychic gift but at the moment I wrote this, none of them came to mind.

I'm curious, how did you become familiar with him? Was it from Remote Viewing, or something else?

Is there anyone that you would have added?

-John

[LarryH]

I would add Edgar Cayce, Joseph McMoneagle, Lyn Buchanan, and Theresa Caputo.

[jbseth]

would add Edgar Cayce, Joseph McMoneagle, Lyn Buchanan, and Theresa Caputo.

Hi LarryH, Hi All,

Yea, I agree LarryH. Thanks for those additions.

I think that it was Joseph and Lyn that I was probably thinking about, in regards to remote viewing.

Of the 4 of them, I'm much less familiar with Theresa, but from what I've heard, she also seems to have some psychic abilities, kind of like John Edward.

Didn't you say at some point in the past that you saw her or might have a chance to go see her?

If so, how was it?

-jbseth

[Sena]

I'm familiar with Ingo Swann's name, from several "Remote Viewing" books that I've read. I know that there were also several other people, having to do with remote viewing that also seemed to have demonstrated a psychic gift but at the moment I wrote this, none of them came to mind.

I'm curious, how did you become familiar with him? Was it from Remote Viewing, or something else?

jbseth, I had read about his remote viewing. The quote above is from his book "The Wisdom Category". I have downloaded this book and could let you have a copy if I have your email address.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25429675-the-wisdom-category

The other writer I would recommend is Gregg Braden, but he is not really a psychic.

[LarryH]

Of the 4 of them, I'm much less familiar with Theresa, but from what I've heard, she also seems to have some psychic abilities, kind of like John Edward.

Didn't you say at some point in the past that you saw her or might have a chance to go see her?

Yes, I saw her 2 or 3 years ago along with about 12,000 others. She's a character.

[jbseth]

jbseth, I had read about his remote viewing. The quote above is from his book "The Wisdom Category". I have downloaded this book and could let you have a copy if I have your email address.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/25429675-the-wisdom-category

The other writer I would recommend is Gregg Braden, but he is not really a psychic.

Hi Sena,

Regarding the Ingo Swann book, thank you very much for your kind offer, but I think I'll pass at this time.

You speak very highly of Gregg Braden. I'm curious about his background.

Do you know much about the man, himself? For example, is he just a writer, is he a philosopher, do you have any idea where he gets his ideas?

-jbseth

[Sena]

Do you know much about the man, himself? For example, is he just a writer, is he a philosopher, do you have any idea where he gets his ideas?

jbseth, this audio interview with Braden may answer some of your questions:

https://radioideaxme.com/2020/04/17/covid-19-a-tale-of-collective-imagination/

[Deb]

Hi guys, so sorry that I've been out of the loop for a few days. I was incredibly busy with some unexpected work etc., and have been trying to get everything done since I had a road trip planned for next Monday. I've been following along here as much as possible, and working on a response when I got a minute or two here and there. It turns out it's going to be fairly long, but stuff important enough to me. BTW I had to cancel my road trip this morning. It was my "The Road to Elmira" trip, I was going to drive out to Elmira and then New Haven, visit with Laurel, Kate, Oshara, Mary and then a NJ friend. But last night NY/NJ/CT suddenly decided that Colorado is one of the "forbidden" states, and I'd have to quarantine for 14 days from my date of arrival. Nope. But at least the Airbnbs didn't give me a hard time with full refunds. I'd planned to do this trip in April or May, but had to reschedule due to covid. Ah well, maybe next spring.

Deb,
In your statement above, you said:
"I'm wary of vaccines because I've read too much about them."
Do you really believe this?
Does this mean that you think that vaccines can actually harm you, without it being your consent to be harmed by them?

No, that's not what I meant. I just don't think they are that effective and am not convinced I need one. My issue is with a mandatory vaccination. I feel I have the right to choose.

I became suspicious of flu shots when local grocery stores were putting up signs and paying for radio ads saying, "Get a FREE flu shot here and save 10% on your grocery bill!" and other perks. Every time I'd walk into a grocery store people would be pushing flu shots. I started to think it was a racket. Big Pharma is a giant money-making business and I'm also not keen on "oh we've a pill for that!" mentality. Our bodies are amazingly adaptable and very competent healers unless an injury or illness is egregious. But I've also read enough stories of spontaneous deathbed healings to know that anything is possible. The mind is an incredible thing. Just look at placebos and nocebos.

As far as covid, I've had my suspicions all along about that too, the way things have been handled compared to other recent pandemics. It almost felt like a social experiment. I did read a Weston Price article that sort of reflects some of the things I've questioned.

Here are some interesting tidbits from the article that I'd not heard before, and these all have footnote references in the actual article:

• "In Italy... more than 99 percent of all coronavirus fatalities were in people who suffered from previous  medical conditions. Another contextual factor that one must consider is that Italy administered a new form of influenza vaccine to elderly Italian for the 2018/2019 season that contained four different strains... According to the US National Vaccine Injury Compensation Program, influenza vaccines cause more injuries and death than all other vaccines combined."

• A section titled "Funny Business With Testing" describes the two different types of CV testing, explains the reason for the false positives and inadequacies.

• In the section "The Infamous Wuhan Lab" shows the individual with the first reported case of CV had no link to the wet market. The Wuhan Institute houses more than 1,500 strains of deadly viruses. It's their specialty.

• The section on herd immunity covers our symbiotic relationship with viruses and bacteria, calling them the "building blocks of our immune system."

• In the section "The Ringleaders," Fauci is quoted: "I hope we do not have so many people infected that we actually have herd immunity." Gates said something similar. Gates committed $10 billion to the WHO in 2010, saying "We must make this the decade of vaccines."

• The same section explains the different new approach towards a vaccine for CV, mRNA and DNA vaccines, where our bodies are given a genetic code to produce the antigen itself, rather than injecting the body with weak or dead pathogens—rewriting our genetic code. I like my genetic code just the way it is.

• In the section "Follow the Money," Moderna announced in April an award to BARDA for up to $483 Million to accelerate an mRNA vaccine.

• Same section: "when only eleven Covid-19 cases were active in the U.S.—HHS followed up with a formal declaration published in the Federal Register confirming that coronavirus vaccine manufacturers will benefit from full immunity from liability. As a result, no American will be able to sue for coronavirus vaccine-related injuries or deaths unless they are able to achieve the nearly impossible task of showing that the government or a manufacturer engaged in "willful misconduct." "

• I'll stop with the "Wait, There's More" section which talks about digital tracking administered by the vaccine.

Not related to the above article, the CDC released updated CV survival rate data which I think is enlightening:

CDC COVID-19 Survival Rates
      Age 0-19 — 99.997%
      Age 20-49 — 99.98%
      Age 50-69 — 99.5%
      Age 70+ — 94.6%

Pretty encouraging, huh?

Update: I had to add this photo I took at a local mall the other day. Needless to say, I didn't go in. Oh, and a pic of an embarrassed bat, only because it's cute. Never thought I'd say that about a bat.

[T.M.]

Hi All,

Hi Deb,

That's a drag about your road trip.  I think a 2nd round of lockdowns is on the way, sadly.

" The same section explains the different new approach towards a vaccine for CV, mRNA and DNA vaccines, where our bodies are given a genetic code to produce the antigen itself, rather than injecting the body with weak or dead pathogens—rewriting our genetic code. I like my genetic code just the way it is."

That's my main objection at this point. I don't think the people designing this vaccine are  intelligent and or morally trustworthy enough to be tampering with humanity's and especially my DNA!

If it was just a normal vaccine, and there really were a provable, significant amount of ill people, I would take a vaccine no problem. I still think that all of this is something other than what's it's advertised as.

[jbseth]

BTW I had to cancel my road trip this morning. It was my "The Road to Elmira" trip, I was going to drive out to Elmira and then New Haven, visit with Laurel, Kate, Oshara, Mary and then a NJ friend. But last night NY/NJ/CT suddenly decided that Colorado is one of the "forbidden" states, and I'd have to quarantine for 14 days from my date of arrival. Nope. But at least the Airbnbs didn't give me a hard time with full refunds.

Hi Deb, Hi All,

On man, I'm really bummed out for you. 

I was looking forward to hearing about this trip and hearing all about your visit at Elmira. At least you found out about the 14 day quarantine before you left.


Yeah, I'm with you on what you said about the vaccines. I don't feel that I'm personally at risk if I were to be given a vaccine, but I'm not to sure I like the idea of some "official" telling me that I have to get one.

I've been in the military. I've seen some of the stupid things that government organizations can do.



In regards to your trip to Elmira, one of the things that they reiterate in the New Thought that I sometimes attend, is the somewhat Sethian type of belief,

"If not this, then something better".

Maybe this trip had to be cancelled now, so that your inner self could arrange an even better for you in the future.  There are no accidents.   

- jbseth

[Deb]

Well I've long felt that everything happens for a reason, whether we know what the reason is or not. I guess that now explains my hesitation to seriously get busy packing up my suitcase and car. I'm hopeful for spring.

Mary and I were also going to drive up to Saratoga Springs during my New Haven visit, which we can still do in spring. And right now the Yale library is off limits due to covid, so maybe by then it will re-open. I've love to see the Roberts collection, but I was willing to go now anyway.

Funny thing, on impulse I called Mary this morning while I was trying to cancel some reservations, and she said she was right in the middle of an email to me, which has happened before. I had sent her my Airbnb confirmation so she would know the address, and she said that Rich Kendall had lived in that same apartment building at one time! How amazing would that be, if I had rented Rich's old apartment? And here I had been sad that I wouldn't be able to meet him in person. You can't make this stuff up.

Yes, there are no accidents. And they also say, "the third time is the charm." That's one that has always played out for me.

And yes T.M., no one gets to mess with my DNA other than me. Like Larry's link--What could go wrong? 

[jbseth]

I think a 2nd round of lockdowns is on the way, sadly.

Hi T.M., Hi All,

I'm curious, is your thinking about the second round of lockdowns just based upon a personal feelings or beliefs or does it come from another source, and is it based upon COVID?

I know that Blossom Goodchild, a woman who channels "The Federation of Light" has been told by them that a more extensive major lockdown is coming. They say that this will be major thing and they don't necessarily say for a fact that it has to do with Covid-19.

I've been observing some comments about Trump in the news, and I've been hearing comments supposedly from him that he's not necessarily planning to step down in November.  I don't quite know what to make of that.


-jbseth

[T.M.]

Hi All

Hi Jbseth,

England is locking down again, Canada as well. I sub to some small channels on YouTube, from people who live in those places, and that's what they are seeing. One gentleman mentioned either Ireland or Scotland is pretty much going along with all of the msm scare memes. I hear Australia has gone down right draconian. Can't confirm from first hand reports.

Personally I think politics is a complete sham. Both sides are working together. The standard routine is good cop vs. bad cop.
Personally I think CV19 is simply a mechanism to bring the entire world into compliance under a United world order. So they can only accelerate the games, with continued lock downs and scare tactics. As well as rewards for compliance.
It's predictable in that way. That's why I say this entire situation is not as advertised.

[T.M.]

P.S.

Just to add. Before all this happened I started watching everything I could on WW2. Couldn't even say why. I normally highly dislike anything WW2 related.

After it all I could not escape the feeling that I didn't watch coverage of an actual war. What I saw was a structural reorganization of multiple countries, under the banner and excuse of a war.

[Sena]

Before all this happened I started watching everything I could on WW2. Couldn't even say why. I normally highly dislike anything WW2 related.

T.M., I am fascinated by WW2. I suspect that I may have had a previous birth in that era. I have been to the Yad Vashem holocaust memorial in Jerusalem twice.

[Sena]

Gates said something similar. Gates committed $10 billion to the WHO in 2010, saying "We must make this the decade of vaccines."

Deb, yes there will be money in the vaccine business. Wait for the advertising campaigns, "My vaccine is better than your vaccine."

[Deb]

Wait for the advertising campaigns, "My vaccine is better than your vaccine."

I can't wait. No one said, ever.

BTW I just found out about a new book by Dr. Thomas Cowan, The Contagion Myth: Why Viruses (including "Coronavirus") Are Not the Cause of Disease. Yes he's an MD, yes he's controversial, but anyone who challenges medical dogma is initially ridiculed and shamed.

I've listened to some of his podcasts and read a few of his articles about covid. Cowan bucks the traditional belief system (germ theory) regarding viruses. A lot of what he says makes sense to me, but I don't have a medical background and so I consider it more information to sift through to see if it fits. His is a different take on viruses, meaning being different from traditional medical beliefs and also Seth's teachings. I've read this before:

"It was Louis Pasteur who convinced a skeptical medical community that contagious germs cause disease; his "germ theory" now serves as the official explanation for most illness. However, in his private diaries he states unequivocally that in his entire career he was not once able to transfer disease with a pure culture of bacteria (he obviously wasn't able to purify viruses at that time). He admitted that the whole effort to prove contagion was a failure, leading to his famous death bed confession that "the germ is nothing, the terrain is everything."

I probably would have passed up this book since it's likely I have already read most of Cowan's theories, but today I found out that Amazon banned the book before it even came out in print, and has entirely removed the title from its website. With all the censorship going on right now, my defiant side decided I needed this book. Many people had placed orders for the print version on Amazon and received emails saying their orders were cancelled and they'd receive full refunds. No explanation.

I got the digital version of the book from Barnes & Noble, and simply had to install the free Nook app on my phone. I'll of course post more about the book if there's anything there.

https://www.barnesandnoble.com/w/contagion-myth-thomas-s-cowan-md/1137427415

[Deb]

And then there's this, here we go!

"Take the jab or lose your job: Medical journal calls for a MANDATORY Covid vaccine, says 'noncompliance should incur a penalty' https://www.rt.com/usa/502270-vaccine-compliance-mandate-study/

"A Yale University study conducted in July evaluated messaging strategies including guilt, economic benefit, trust in science, embarrassment, and community benefit to measure the effects on not only confidence in the vaccine itself but how willing the participants were to persuade others to take the shot – and how much they feared or looked down on those who had not received it."

Is it just me, or is this total manipulation? This all seems so unreal to me. Just 9 months ago, life felt so normal.

[T.M.]

Hi All,

Hi Deb,

"Is it just me, or is this total manipulation? This all seems so unreal to me. Just 9 months ago, life felt so normal."

No it's not just you. It is total manipulation.

[T.M.]

P.S.

That's how they are going to get around making it mandatory. Just like the masks. They will get the corporations to say if you want to use our businesses or services or keep your employment, you will have to be vaccinated per our company policy.

[jbseth]

BTW I just found out about a new book by Dr. Thomas Cowan, The Contagion Myth: Why Viruses (including "Coronavirus") Are Not the Cause of Disease. Yes he's an MD, yes he's controversial, but anyone who challenges medical dogma is initially ridiculed and shamed.

Hi Deb, Hi All,

Seth says quite about viruses in NOME.  Given what Seth says below, I not sure that Seth would agree with him.

Seth seems to be pointing out that viruses are in our body all the time and we couldn't live with out them. 
While they can be deadly, they are also "triggered" into activity.   

Seth also says that the body knows the difference between a lab created virus and a natural one. I'm not sure whether this is known or understood by medical researchers. If they don't realize this, and Seth is correct about it, then this probably causes some confusion with them in some of their test results.



NOME, Ch 1, S801:

In the first place, the causes are not biological. Biology is simply the carrier of a "deadly intent." In the second place, there is a difference between a virus produced in the laboratory and that inhabiting the body — a difference recognized by the body but not by your laboratory instruments.




NOME, Ch 6, S840:

(Vigorously:) You could not live without viruses, nor could your biological reality as you know it now exist.

(Pause.) Viruses appear to be "the bad guys," and as a rule you think of them separately, as for example the smallpox virus. There are overall affiliations in which viruses take part, however, in which delicate balances are maintained biologically. Each body contains countless viruses that could be deadly at any given time and under certain conditions. These — and I am putting it as simply as possible — take turns being active or inactive within the body, in accordance with the body's overall condition. Viruses that are "deadly" in certain stages are not in others, and in those later stages they react biologically in quite beneficial ways, adding to the body's stability by bringing about necessary changes, say, in cellular activities that are helpful at given rates of action. These in turn trigger other cellular changes, again of a beneficial nature.

[...]

(9:38.) Give us a moment ... The viruses in the body have a social, cooperative existence. Their effects become deadly only under certain conditions. The viruses must be triggered into destructive activity, and this happens only at a certain point, when the individual involved is actively seeking either death or a crisis situation biologically.


-jbseth

[T.M.]

Hi All,

Hi Jbseth,

Excellent excerpt from Seth/Nome Thanks!

[Sena]

The viruses must be triggered into destructive activity, and this happens only at a certain point, when the individual involved is actively seeking either death or a crisis situation biologically.

jbseth, that is exactly right. Death with Covid 19 is caused by how the body reacts to it (the immune response):

"We propose some simple, but largely ignored, approaches to the treatment of COVID-19 patients (Fig. 1). We believe that the two-phase division is very important: the first immune defense-based protective phase and the second inflammation-driven damaging phase. Doctors should try to boost immune responses during the first, while suppressing it in the second phase. Since Vitamin B3 is highly lung protective, it should be used as soon as coughing begins."

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41418-020-0530-3

[Sena]

BTW I just found out about a new book by Dr. Thomas Cowan, The Contagion Myth: Why Viruses (including "Coronavirus") Are Not the Cause of Disease. Yes he's an MD, yes he's controversial, but anyone who challenges medical dogma is initially ridiculed and shamed.

Deb, thanks for recommending this. I managed to download it from my secret website, but it is NOT available on Amazon UK.

It is available on Scribd:

https://www.scribd.com/book/476501065/The-Contagion-Myth-Why-Viruses-including-Coronavirus-Are-Not-the-Cause-of-Disease

Tom Cowan tells us here why the book is banned on Amazon (Amazon is doing well out of all the lockdowns):

https://www.bitchute.com/video/qV8nWp4XGw30/

There is some fascinating stuff in this book:

"Since remdesivir gave disappointing results, health officials are seeking other remedies. One
suggestion is dexamethasone, a potent steroid that can shrink the brain. Dexamethasone makes
sense if Covid-19 is an inflammation rather than an "infection."23 In fact, one of the first things
medical students learn is that steroids like dexamethasone make infections worse. Since
dexamethasone may make Covid-19 better, this demonstrates that the illness can't be an infection."

Cowan makes the controversial claim that the so-called Covid 19 illness is NOT caused by a virus, but by the installation of 5G antennae:

"On September 26, 2019, 5G wireless was turned on in Wuhan, China (and officially
launched November 1) with a grid of about ten thousand 5G base stations—more than exist in the
entire United States—all concentrated in one city.17 A spike in cases occurred on February 13—the
same week that Wuhan turned on its 5G network for monitoring traffic.18
Illness has followed 5G installation in all the major cities in America, starting with New
York in Fall 2019 in Manhattan, along with parts of Brooklyn, the Bronx, and Queens—all
subsequent coronavirus hot spots. Los Angeles, Las Vegas, Dallas, Cleveland, and Atlanta soon
followed, with some five thousand towns and cities now covered. Citizens of the small country of
San Marino (the first country in the world to install 5G, in September 2018) have had the longest
exposure to 5G and the highest infection rate—four times higher than Italy (which deployed 5G in
June 2019), and twenty-seven times higher than Croatia, which has not deployed 5G."


"Without getting too deep into the engineering of 5G technology, the important thing about
5G is that the pulsed millimeter waves, this new "spectrum" that will run our phones and computers
faster, need to be "organized" by placing hundreds of thousands of satellites right into the
ionosphere of the earth. These hundreds of thousands of satellites will emit their own
electromagnetic frequencies that essentially beam these new, man-made signals down to the
millions of receivers placed in our neighborhoods, stadiums, schools, nursing homes, hospitals,
parks, farms, lakes, forests, oceans, and everywhere else on earth. The intention is to blanket the
earth with these manmade electromagnetic fields."

From the Sethian point of view, we need to think of EE (electromagnetic) units:

"All of an individual's experiences, even those of which he is not aware on a conscious basis, therefore are part of the electromagnetic reality that forms this particular individual's electromagnetic identity. It exists within the physical matter of the organism during existence within the physical system. While the experiences which form this framework and compose this individual's identity are obtained through his interaction with the physical system, his electromagnetic identity is not dependent upon the physical field."
—TES4 Session 197 October 11, 1965

"However, as Seth says, consciousness units never leave the non-physical state. How, then, do the physical properties of our reality take shape, if not from units of consciousness? It all starts, but does not end, with this next building block of greater reality-electromagnetic energy (EE) units. All consciousness gestalts emanate electromagnetic energy units naturally. They are what Seth calls carriers of perception, and are invisible formations built up in response to emotional intensities that result from a reaction by consciousness to any stimuli, including thoughts and feelings." (from "Living a Safe Universe, Vol. 3: A Book for Seth Readers (Living a Safe Universe: A Book for Seth Readers)" by Lynda Madden Dahl)

Kindle edition: https://amzn.eu/6dJSJyV

"Each of you act as transformers, unconsciously, automatically transforming highly sophisticated electromagnetic units into physical objects. You are in the middle of a "matter-concentrated system," surrounded, so to speak, by weaker areas in which what you would call "pseudomatter" persists. Each thought and emotion spontaneously exists as a simple or complex electromagnetic unit — unperceived, incidentally, as yet by your scientists." (from "Seth Speaks: The Eternal Validity of the Soul (A Seth Book)" by Jane Roberts)

"There are electromagnetic structures, so to speak, that are presently beyond your instruments. (Pause.) Units that are the basic carriers of perception. They have a very brief life in your terms. Their size varies. Several units may combine for example, many units may combine. To put this as simply as possible, it is not so much that they move through space, as that they use space to move through. There is a difference.  In a manner of speaking, thermal qualities are involved, laws also of attraction and repulsion. The units charge the air through which they pass, and draw to them other units. The units are not stationary in the way that a cell say, is stationary within the body, generally speaking. Even a cell, for example, only appears stationary. These units have no home. They are built up in response to emotional intensity. They are one form that emotional intensity takes." (from "The Early Sessions: Book 9 of The Seth Material" by Jane Roberts, Robert Butts)

Cowan on vaccines:
"It's clear that a vaccine is not going to save us—in fact it has the potential of inflicting
enormous suffering on the world's population, not to mention violent resistance to the idea of
universal gene modification by electroporation. And all for an illness that is not contagious!"

Even if Cowan is wrong about the viral origin of this illness, as Sethians we need to be concerned about this "blanket of electromagnetic fields" that is going to cover us. This article in Scientific American is interesting:

"Citing this large body of research, more than 240 scientists who have published peer-reviewed research on the biologic and health effects of nonionizing electromagnetic fields (EMF) signed the International EMF Scientist Appeal, which calls for stronger exposure limits. The appeal makes the following assertions:

"Numerous recent scientific publications have shown that EMF affects living organisms at levels well below most international and national guidelines. Effects include increased cancer risk, cellular stress, increase in harmful free radicals, genetic damages, structural and functional changes of the reproductive system, learning and memory deficits, neurological disorders, and negative impacts on general well-being in humans."

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/observations/we-have-no-reason-to-believe-5g-is-safe/

[T.M.]

Hi All,

Hi Sena,
I thought you might find this interesting, and considering it all has to do with the employment of a man made manipulation of electromagnetic waves, perhaps there is something to it. I'm not sure I agree with this, I do find it interesting.
The following article is written to debunk the idea, it's the closest link I could find to the basic idea there's a link to technologies and epidemics.

The Facebook post infers the correlations as follows:

5G launched, COVID-19 2019.
4G launched, H1N1 2009.
3G launched, Influenza 1998.
2G Launched, Cholera 1991.
1G launched, influenza 1979".
It then goes on to state "The introduction of radio waves caused the Spanish flu of 1918".

https://www.aap.com.au/dates-dont-line-up-when-comparing-disease-epidemics-and-new-mobile-technology-rollouts/

[Sena]

It then goes on to state "The introduction of radio waves caused the Spanish flu of 1918".

T.M., thanks for that information. I certainly don't agree with radio waves causing Spanish flu. According to Cowan, 5G is something very unique. Just imagine hundreds of thousands of satellites emitting electromagnetic waves.

"Video sharing platform YouTube has begun taking down videos linking 5G with COVID-19 in an effort to stop false information spreading but theories claiming a link between the virus and telecommunications technologies are still spreading on Facebook."
That is obviously censorship. Are they so scared of this point of view?