"last reincarnation"

[theportalishere]

When Seth says things like "last reincarnation" is Seth talking about on earth or anywhere in the physical universe? To be done with the physical universe forever doesn't make sense to me as there are countless planets and galaxies to explore. Thoughts?

[Deb]

Hi theportalishere, welcome to the forum!

My thought is that Seth means last reincarnation anywhere. He's mentioned that while we incarnate in this physical existence, we also have counterparts in other "systems," so by the time of our last incarnation, we have had a chance to explore, have accomplished and learned what we intended to, our entity has expanded to it's satisfaction and we are ready to graduate.

"Far be it from me to give either Ruburt or yourself swelled heads, but in your cases we see the male and female aspects well-balanced, one of the reasons why this is your last incarnation. These elements are highly unstable and each personality works them out."
—TES9 Session 441 October 9, 1968

Seth did say that some of the graduates may choose to come back in special instances, such as a teaching opportunity, and it's purely their choice.

You may want to take a look at this, lots of good info here: https://findingseth.com/q/session:547+teachers+reincarnation/

[Bora137]

Hi theportalishere welcome. I see the physical plane as the simplest to understand so when developing our consciousness we start with the simplest. It's like playschool - objects are solid and mostly unchanging (at least from our perspective), everything is an easy to understand symbol of a more complex truth beneath which we are not ready to understand - like a tree is not a tree it's a symbol of what a tree is which exists at deeper levels. So we are sort at the first level of a video game, learning the ropes, building a framework of meaning to understand this beginners' reality. So once mastered you can move on to deeper realities ever closer to the ultimate truth of all existence. If Seth incarnated into earth plane now there wouldn't be a great deal for him to learn. That said earth plane offers many learning opportunities because it is so intense and it is used by more developed consciousnesses if they still are in need of lessons earth plane can provide but often those higher consciousnesses return to earth to help those struggling to progress. I don't mean return in astral form like Seth they return as a human, yes as teachers but also as just normal people to help those souls they are close to and traveling with. So Seth might yet be back physically, I mean this in both our sense of time (though Seth might choose a different historic period) and also in Seth's terms of time, that being psychological growth.

[theportalishere]

It still seems very quick that we would be "done" with physical incarnations. There are countless planets and galaxies to explore so it doesnt seem like we would be done so quickly. Has Seth ever talked about incarnating on other physical planets besides earth?

[Bora137]

At Seth's level he can experience an entire incarnation's existence in a moment, not one of his own incarnations but anyone's. So he experiences all these other worlds whenever he likes. Like we might watch a film or listen to a song.

[theportalishere]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

[Bora137]

You are completely free to do this. For a holiday Seth says he spends a hundred years as a tree so all forms of physical existence remain open. And if you are strongly drawn to physical existence you can become an expert on it.

[Deb]

there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

There are some individual consciousnesses that really enjoy the earthly physical existence, and I imagine they incarnate way more than those that just want to get it over with.

BTW @Bora137 thanks for mentioning the tree holiday, I was just looking and looking for a quote for that and you put me out of my misery, lol.

I think maybe you're seeing the individuals we are now as the only form of "we"? The "wes" that we are here and now are only one fraction of our greater selves, which are experiencing an enormous variety of incarnations. We are multidimensional, we just can't imagine that right now. Seth did talk about space travel with respect to our physical reality, but mostly that we have it all wrong as far as to how to do it. Our nonphysical selves have the ability to explore other systems, physically we are pretty much self-contained and focused in our current reality—terms we accepted. In Seth Speaks Seth did talk about "earlier" earthly civilizations that left for existences on other planets in other galaxies.

Seth also said this with respect to our physical universe:

"Your planetary systems exist at once, simultaneously, both in time and in space. The universe that you seem to perceive, either visually or through instruments, appears to be composed of galaxies, stars, and planets, at various distances from you. Basically, however, this is an illusion. Your senses and your very existence as physical creatures program you to perceive the universe in such a way. The universe as you know it is your interpretation of events as they intrude upon your three-dimensional reality. The events are mental. This does not mean that you cannot travel to other planets, for example, within that physical universe, any more than it means that you cannot use tables to hold books, glasses, and oranges (as our coffee table did at that moment), although the table has no solid qualities of its own."
—SS Chapter 3: Session 519, March 23, 1970

So are we seeing other planets, or are they other systems that we interpret as planets? There are other physical systems, and non-physical systems, and probably more that I can't imagine.  https://findingseth.com/q/session:446+other+systems/

[Bora137]

I couldn't find it in findingseth either @Deb I tried tree + hundred + century + holiday and variations of but it still didn't come up but I'm rubbish at using that search engine 🙄

[Deb]

Search engines are not always reliable, it's not you. I even searched here, and came up with a post of mine from a couple of years ago saying I couldn't find the quote. 

It could have been in one of the books that are not scanned into the findingseth database, I think two are the Seth Material and Conversations With Seth. Which I have in PDF form. And I searched. Not in there either. Maybe in Speaking of Jane Roberts...

I emailed Ron Card tonight, hopefully he can give us a clue. I'm a "I want to know" kinda person so don't give up easily, lol.

[chasman]

its in Seth Speaks:


"SS Chapter 2: Session 514, February 9, 1970

To this extent we indulge in relaxation and sleep, for we can spend a century as a tree or as an uncomplicated life form in another reality. We delight our consciousness with the enjoyment of simple existence. We may create, you see, the forest in which we grow. Usually however we are highly active, our full energies focused in our work and in new challenges."

[theportalishere]

You are completely free to do this. For a holiday Seth says he spends a hundred years as a tree so all forms of physical existence remain open. And if you are strongly drawn to physical existence you can become an expert on it.

Ya, it just seems nice to go back into the physical every once in a while. An eternity in non physical seems like it would get boring and the forgetfulness that the physical provides seems to spice things up lol. The physical universe seems just as eternal as non physical and I'd be happy to go back and forth between physical and non physical forever!

[Bora137]

I agree the forgetting we experience here makes everything more real more vital. There are physicals though where the veil is less dense and other 'past' incarnational lives are known to the individual. Seth hints that this way of being will come to earth in the next few hundred years and other sources agree - Ra and the great cycle of the zodiac also says this time is coming.

[theportalishere]

Interesting. That would be nice to have less forgetfulness and would probably mean less suffering in the physical. I'm sure there are other planets that are already at that level of advancement.

[Deb]

its in Seth Speaks:

SS Chapter 2: Session 514, February 9, 1970

Holy mackerel Charlie, you just pulled that one right out of a hat! Thank you so much for finding that, it was really bugging me.

That whole chapter is really interesting—"My Present Environment, Work, and Activities".

[chasman]

you are so very welcome Deb.
it rang a bell for me.
and yes that whole chapter is super interesting. 

[Tob]

Session 108: "A personality reincarnates into different form, you have the retention of the original personality, intact, with its memories in the subconscious; and you have the additional formation of a completely new personality time after time. There is a splitting away from the original psychic branch, but with memory of previous individual existence. (...)

The individuals continue to exist, and express themselves according to their development in other fields not connected with yours, when they are finished on your plane. No particular identity is ever lost. If so the whole process would be meaningless. And in other ways to lesser degrees, through abstract thought, through art of any kind, the physical human being, having been formed by consciousness, in his own way then working through and with matter, constructs other fields or planes of attraction, which according to their abilities expand. This is not difficult to understand when you consider the relative difficulty in understanding even the simplest of physical phenomena alone."


Session 32:

"In the present personality we have abilities developed in past lives, and ability to paint for example that should be made more use of now. What you call Ruburt's sales ability is also a result of past experiences, and certain other latent abilities such as a facility with growing plants. He was at one time an excellent farmer. There has been here a willingness to experience, to experiment and to give as well as a ferocious capacity to take in. The trouble in the past has been a lack of discretion and self-discipline. He was always a pleasure loving personality however and avoided anything unpleasant.

His early circumstances in this life were chosen by him as a needed experience. In other lives he was able to exist without too much adversity and this time he chose troublesome and truly tragic circumstances as a needed challenge. His temper when aroused was very great however and he retaliated instantly. He had never known hatred however. This time he has had to deal with it in a most intimate manner. The old stormy temper is now seen in Ruburt's deep grudges. The personality of Ruburt's mother was not close to him in any other life. The circumstances of birth were chosen at the last minute on his part and was made for two reasons. One, the personality of the mother offered needed experience for Ruburt; and two, the paganistic personality of the father was in some degree like his own past personalities though in a much more vague and watered down way. A miscarriage later on the part of Ruburt's mother represented an entity who changed his mind so to speak. He was at one time a brother. Ruburt's present shape is something he has been working for. He was often tall, hardy and stout. (...)

This time you are both on your last reincarnation cycle on your plane, and as a rule no personality fragments are left behind. ("What would happen if we did have a child?") This happens fairly often. It does not change the fact that it is the last reincarnation cycle for parents for example, although it may be lonely for the child in such an instance. I have not gone into these questions; however, to some degree in the subconscious mind you have what could be called a ghost image of your ancestors, and when your parents are in their last reincarnation cycle they leave your plane and it is more difficult for the ghost image to be imprinted. What you would call the wisdom of instinct is not then so sure.

There have been however a few periods in mankind's history when this happened en masse. It just worked out that way that a large majority of personalities finished their cycles more or less at one time. ("When was the last time this happened?") The Middle Ages represented such a break, and I also suggest a break. (...)

When the Middle Ages began a large number of personalities who had lived before and during the Roman period were ready to end their reincarnation cycles. There were the most efficient learners, the wisest and most able personalities, and they withdrew their subconscious knowledge and memories from your plane. This was one of the reasons for the decay of knowledge and learning in the Middle Ages. There were personalities reincarnated during the Middle Ages who had lived during the Roman experience, however they were not leading personalities and they were not able to transmit knowledge or abilities from past lives, simply because they had not the inherent strength or capability needed.

There were other personalities of course who were fairly developed but these were resting. The world so to speak got back on its feet when these personalities reappeared centuries later; and by this time new personalities who had taken the place of those whose cycles were completed also began to use and show their abilities. ("In what century did the withdrawal take place?") By the end of the 10th century the first group of personalities completed their cycle. It took the period of time from then until the late 1600's for any valid readjustment to take place, and by the middle 17th century you began to get bursts of beneficial activities and new thrusts of knowledge. The monks who copied old manuscripts and preserved some remnants of knowledge did so because of their own past personal connection and experience with the knowledge itself. ("Were the French and American revolutions related to such a burst?") The revolutions, both of them, were so connected, representing an offshoot from the freedoms initiated in Athens and greatly expanded. Great Britain was in many respects a special place in that many of those personalities who had been resting were born there at fairly regular intervals, and you had a more consistent belief in liberty that did not necessitate such bloody and unfortunate revolutions as those that occurred elsewhere.

("What's the case in Russia today?") Today? ("Well, in this century then.") It is in many ways the fault of personalities themselves as to which lands are developed or underdeveloped in various ways. Many personalities prefer rebirth in pleasant temperate or warm climates. Often they congregate for such selfish reasons in pleasant climates and in countries where political situations are not dangerous. This has been the case with the country of Russia in the past but it may not be the case in the future; as activity grows there intellectual and psychic attractions will draw stronger and wiser personalities. The same in a somewhat different manner will apply to countries in Africa.
 
There are whole areas of material here that we have not discussed so that this is spotty, but we will go into it more deeply. There are no laws to force personalities to use all their abilities. A personality will not choose unfavorable circumstances of rebirth until he himself sees that necessary discipline can be achieved in no other manner. Therefore extremely hot and extremely cold countries go largely undeveloped. But once development begins to occur it is swift. The problems that a country must work out merely represent the problems set by the personality inhabitants for themselves, and the country is merely the framework of such activities.

There is a close bond between reincarnational cycles and earthly historical periods that we will discuss later. Sometimes though not always personalities who need a certain experience will be born into a particular country or race. I have been somewhat avoiding this whole issue since delicate balances are interconnected (...)
------------------------

From the above I understand that there is a close bond between reincarnational cycles and earthly historical periods. I also understand that a reincarnation is a completely new personality, time after time.

[strangerthings]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

[theportalishere]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

If all incarnations are simultaneous then every incarnation is the last one. So once all incarnations are done, what do you do? Just stay in non physical forever? Why would we not want to continue to explore physical reality every once in a while? Is there some rule that says "sorry you've had enough, no more physical for you!"

[theportalishere]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

How do I know that I haven't what? By the time I get to my last incarnation, I will have what? Can you please clarify what you are referring to.

The idea of a "last" anything in the scope of eternity just seems silly. So we finish our "last incarnation" after some thousands of years and now we just hang out in non physical for a bagillion million forever years!??? lol. That makes no sense to me. Why would we want to be "done" with physical forever when there is so much richness of experience to be had in a physical incarnation. 

[inavalan]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

How do I know that I haven't what? By the time I get to my last incarnation, I will have what? Can you please clarify what you are referring to.

The idea of a "last" anything in the scope of eternity just seems silly. So we finish our "last incarnation" after some thousands of years and now we just hang out in non physical for a bagillion million forever years!??? lol. That makes no sense to me. Why would we want to be "done" with physical forever when there is so much richness of experience to be had in a physical incarnation.

Think in terms of attending a school.

Once you graduate, you move on to new activities that you can't imagine as a student. To graduate, you have to evolve (a.k.a. learn), and that isn't proportional with the number of incarnations, but with their quality. The number of incarnations has no connection with the physical time. Next time, you can incarnate in the past, present, or future, depending on what you need and want to learn.

A major difficulty is that we forgot what we incarnated to learn, and this is because of what Seth calls "natural hypnosis". If we succeed in becoming lucid (like becoming lucid in a dream), we can find out what we are here to learn, and how to get the knowledge and guidance to achieve that.

Another reason not to remember why we are here is because we need to get immersed in the learning experience. This is a relevant quote from Session 303, TES7:

• ... If you realized thoroughly that your physical world was an illusion, you would not be experiencing sense data.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Can't I experience an illusion that I create for myself?")
  You can experience the illusion, but when you experience the illusion as an illusion, you no longer experience it.  You are running ahead of yourself.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But there's nowhere to go.")
  You do not know.  You think it.  You will not be where you are.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be?")
  No and yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be that is not illusion?")
  I say this to you and I tell you, yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  " How would I know the difference?  Is there any way to distinguish between illusion and reality other than by a creation of my own mind?")
  You do not know it now.  When that point is reached, you will be able, if you prefer, to experience any "Reality-Illusion" at your will, but the self who experiences these "Reality-Illusions" will know itself as reality.  There is no place for it to go, because it is the only reality and will create its own environment.
  ...
  ([Gene]:  "We have come full circle.  I am one with what reality I create.  There is nowhere to go.")
  You must still be able to experience any one of these illusions. Knowing they are illusory with full knowledge of their nature and still know that the basic reality is yourself. There is no place to go, because you are the place, in those terms, and all places.  But the joke is relevant.  The most important thing I have said to you this evening is that the joke is relevant.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Yes, I would agree.")
  You must be free enough to explore the nature and experience of every living thing within your own system knowing that it is yourself and then leave your system.  These must be direct experiences.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But I can't leave the system because I am in all systems simultaneously.")
  I am speaking in physical terms.  Even in physical terms, in very limited physical terms, you are still dealing with other systems.
  
  ([Gene]:  "I have no choice.")
  I am using terms of continuity now simply for explanation.  First there must be a period, and then it has passed, when you are completely immersed in a given system as if no other existed.  Value fulfillment AS A RULE being achieved in this manner.  This does not mean you are not dwelling in other systems simultaneously.  The illusion must be probed to its depth.

[/list]

[theportalishere]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

How do I know that I haven't what? By the time I get to my last incarnation, I will have what? Can you please clarify what you are referring to.

The idea of a "last" anything in the scope of eternity just seems silly. So we finish our "last incarnation" after some thousands of years and now we just hang out in non physical for a bagillion million forever years!??? lol. That makes no sense to me. Why would we want to be "done" with physical forever when there is so much richness of experience to be had in a physical incarnation.

Think in terms of attending a school.

Once you graduate, you move on to new activities that you can't imagine as a student. To graduate, you have to evolve (a.k.a. learn), and that isn't proportional with the number of incarnations, but with their quality. The number of incarnations has no connection with the physical time. Next time, you can incarnate in the past, present, or future, depending on what you need and want to learn.

A major difficulty is that we forgot what we incarnated to learn, and this is because of what Seth calls "natural hypnosis". If we succeed in becoming lucid (like becoming lucid in a dream), we can find out what we are here to learn, and how to get the knowledge and guidance to achieve that.

Another reason not to remember why we are here is because we need to get immersed in the learning experience. This is a relevant quote from Session 303, TES7:

• ... If you realized thoroughly that your physical world was an illusion, you would not be experiencing sense data.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Can't I experience an illusion that I create for myself?")
  You can experience the illusion, but when you experience the illusion as an illusion, you no longer experience it.  You are running ahead of yourself.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But there's nowhere to go.")
  You do not know.  You think it.  You will not be where you are.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be?")
  No and yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be that is not illusion?")
  I say this to you and I tell you, yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  " How would I know the difference?  Is there any way to distinguish between illusion and reality other than by a creation of my own mind?")
  You do not know it now.  When that point is reached, you will be able, if you prefer, to experience any "Reality-Illusion" at your will, but the self who experiences these "Reality-Illusions" will know itself as reality.  There is no place for it to go, because it is the only reality and will create its own environment.
  ...
  ([Gene]:  "We have come full circle.  I am one with what reality I create.  There is nowhere to go.")
  You must still be able to experience any one of these illusions. Knowing they are illusory with full knowledge of their nature and still know that the basic reality is yourself. There is no place to go, because you are the place, in those terms, and all places.  But the joke is relevant.  The most important thing I have said to you this evening is that the joke is relevant.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Yes, I would agree.")
  You must be free enough to explore the nature and experience of every living thing within your own system knowing that it is yourself and then leave your system.  These must be direct experiences.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But I can't leave the system because I am in all systems simultaneously.")
  I am speaking in physical terms.  Even in physical terms, in very limited physical terms, you are still dealing with other systems.
  
  ([Gene]:  "I have no choice.")
  I am using terms of continuity now simply for explanation.  First there must be a period, and then it has passed, when you are completely immersed in a given system as if no other existed.  Value fulfillment AS A RULE being achieved in this manner.  This does not mean you are not dwelling in other systems simultaneously.  The illusion must be probed to its depth.

[/list]

Ya none of this resonates with me. There's nowhere to go like he said. What's the point in graduating? Where are you gonna go? Why can't physical realty exist simply for the joy of creation? Why does there have to be some end goal of "graduation"?

[strangerthings]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

If all incarnations are simultaneous then every incarnation is the last one. So once all incarnations are done, what do you do? Just stay in non physical forever? Why would we not want to continue to explore physical reality every once in a while? Is there some rule that says "sorry you've had enough, no more physical for you!"

I hear ya

Though we are in outer ego, Soul in flesh on Earth, Once that is no longer the case I will not think from an outer ego.

I will say "k Im done". lol

[strangerthings]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

If all incarnations are simultaneous then every incarnation is the last one. So once all incarnations are done, what do you do? Just stay in non physical forever? Why would we not want to continue to explore physical reality every once in a while? Is there some rule that says "sorry you've had enough, no more physical for you!"

All eyes are on this life now.

This life is now a central focus. It wasnt before. My Entity self is focused on me as this individual. I affect all incarnations at this point of power.

I say, get into lucid dreaming and understand why you are here. All of your answers are within you. Ask for a dream to explain it to you. You will be the only one to personalize such an understanding.

There is .... an intelligence, inside of you, reachable in the lucid state that will answer your questions when you are ready. If its that important to you to know... thats where I suggest getting understanding and understandable answers.

[strangerthings]

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

How do I know that I haven't what? By the time I get to my last incarnation, I will have what? Can you please clarify what you are referring to.

The idea of a "last" anything in the scope of eternity just seems silly. So we finish our "last incarnation" after some thousands of years and now we just hang out in non physical for a bagillion million forever years!??? lol. That makes no sense to me. Why would we want to be "done" with physical forever when there is so much richness of experience to be had in a physical incarnation.

Think in terms of attending a school.

Once you graduate, you move on to new activities that you can't imagine as a student. To graduate, you have to evolve (a.k.a. learn), and that isn't proportional with the number of incarnations, but with their quality. The number of incarnations has no connection with the physical time. Next time, you can incarnate in the past, present, or future, depending on what you need and want to learn.

A major difficulty is that we forgot what we incarnated to learn, and this is because of what Seth calls "natural hypnosis". If we succeed in becoming lucid (like becoming lucid in a dream), we can find out what we are here to learn, and how to get the knowledge and guidance to achieve that.

Another reason not to remember why we are here is because we need to get immersed in the learning experience. This is a relevant quote from Session 303, TES7:

• ... If you realized thoroughly that your physical world was an illusion, you would not be experiencing sense data.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Can't I experience an illusion that I create for myself?")
  You can experience the illusion, but when you experience the illusion as an illusion, you no longer experience it.  You are running ahead of yourself.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But there's nowhere to go.")
  You do not know.  You think it.  You will not be where you are.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be?")
  No and yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be that is not illusion?")
  I say this to you and I tell you, yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  " How would I know the difference?  Is there any way to distinguish between illusion and reality other than by a creation of my own mind?")
  You do not know it now.  When that point is reached, you will be able, if you prefer, to experience any "Reality-Illusion" at your will, but the self who experiences these "Reality-Illusions" will know itself as reality.  There is no place for it to go, because it is the only reality and will create its own environment.
  ...
  ([Gene]:  "We have come full circle.  I am one with what reality I create.  There is nowhere to go.")
  You must still be able to experience any one of these illusions. Knowing they are illusory with full knowledge of their nature and still know that the basic reality is yourself. There is no place to go, because you are the place, in those terms, and all places.  But the joke is relevant.  The most important thing I have said to you this evening is that the joke is relevant.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Yes, I would agree.")
  You must be free enough to explore the nature and experience of every living thing within your own system knowing that it is yourself and then leave your system.  These must be direct experiences.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But I can't leave the system because I am in all systems simultaneously.")
  I am speaking in physical terms.  Even in physical terms, in very limited physical terms, you are still dealing with other systems.
  
  ([Gene]:  "I have no choice.")
  I am using terms of continuity now simply for explanation.  First there must be a period, and then it has passed, when you are completely immersed in a given system as if no other existed.  Value fulfillment AS A RULE being achieved in this manner.  This does not mean you are not dwelling in other systems simultaneously.  The illusion must be probed to its depth.

[/list]

Ya none of this resonates with me. There's nowhere to go like he said. What's the point in graduating? Where are you gonna go? Why can't physical realty exist simply for the joy of creation? Why does there have to be some end goal of "graduation"?

right, but there's still something to be said about fully immersing into a physical life. We have all eternity. It seems like a physical life every once in a while would be nice lol.

How do you know you haven't?
Perhaps you're forgetting (?) about your "from your terms your future self" has. All of its simulataneous incarnations.

By the time you get to your last incarnation, you will have.

I feel like I have been on the boat of a million years and I am on year 999,999 at the tail end! lol

How do I know that I haven't what? By the time I get to my last incarnation, I will have what? Can you please clarify what you are referring to.

The idea of a "last" anything in the scope of eternity just seems silly. So we finish our "last incarnation" after some thousands of years and now we just hang out in non physical for a bagillion million forever years!??? lol. That makes no sense to me. Why would we want to be "done" with physical forever when there is so much richness of experience to be had in a physical incarnation.

Think in terms of attending a school.

Once you graduate, you move on to new activities that you can't imagine as a student. To graduate, you have to evolve (a.k.a. learn), and that isn't proportional with the number of incarnations, but with their quality. The number of incarnations has no connection with the physical time. Next time, you can incarnate in the past, present, or future, depending on what you need and want to learn.

A major difficulty is that we forgot what we incarnated to learn, and this is because of what Seth calls "natural hypnosis". If we succeed in becoming lucid (like becoming lucid in a dream), we can find out what we are here to learn, and how to get the knowledge and guidance to achieve that.

Another reason not to remember why we are here is because we need to get immersed in the learning experience. This is a relevant quote from Session 303, TES7:

• ... If you realized thoroughly that your physical world was an illusion, you would not be experiencing sense data.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Can't I experience an illusion that I create for myself?")
  You can experience the illusion, but when you experience the illusion as an illusion, you no longer experience it.  You are running ahead of yourself.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But there's nowhere to go.")
  You do not know.  You think it.  You will not be where you are.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be?")
  No and yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Is there anywhere else to be that is not illusion?")
  I say this to you and I tell you, yes.
  
  ([Gene]:  " How would I know the difference?  Is there any way to distinguish between illusion and reality other than by a creation of my own mind?")
  You do not know it now.  When that point is reached, you will be able, if you prefer, to experience any "Reality-Illusion" at your will, but the self who experiences these "Reality-Illusions" will know itself as reality.  There is no place for it to go, because it is the only reality and will create its own environment.
  ...
  ([Gene]:  "We have come full circle.  I am one with what reality I create.  There is nowhere to go.")
  You must still be able to experience any one of these illusions. Knowing they are illusory with full knowledge of their nature and still know that the basic reality is yourself. There is no place to go, because you are the place, in those terms, and all places.  But the joke is relevant.  The most important thing I have said to you this evening is that the joke is relevant.
  
  ([Gene]:  "Yes, I would agree.")
  You must be free enough to explore the nature and experience of every living thing within your own system knowing that it is yourself and then leave your system.  These must be direct experiences.
  
  ([Gene]:  "But I can't leave the system because I am in all systems simultaneously.")
  I am speaking in physical terms.  Even in physical terms, in very limited physical terms, you are still dealing with other systems.
  
  ([Gene]:  "I have no choice.")
  I am using terms of continuity now simply for explanation.  First there must be a period, and then it has passed, when you are completely immersed in a given system as if no other existed.  Value fulfillment AS A RULE being achieved in this manner.  This does not mean you are not dwelling in other systems simultaneously.  The illusion must be probed to its depth.

[/list]

Ya none of this resonates with me. There's nowhere to go like he said. What's the point in graduating? Where are you gonna go? Why can't physical realty exist simply for the joy of creation? Why does there have to be some end goal of "graduation"?

Home IS where the heart is.
You bring "there" ... here.
You dont GO to the reality you desire. You bring it to you.
That's powerful to me.
When you want a probable version of your life as you to be your life, you pull it to you. You dont go to ... it.

If you want a healthier body, you dont go to a healthier body, you bring it to you. Overwriting your present experience.

[Sena]

What's the point in graduating?

I agree. "Graduation" is NOT a Seth concept.

[inavalan]

What a wise four year old!



Occurred on March 1, 2022 / Elk Grove, California, USA Info from Licensor: "My 4 year old daughter (Stella) is very protective of her 1 year old baby brother (Kenzo). Kenzo broke our floor cabinet in the bathroom. Stella was in the middle of teaching me some lessons in parenting when I took this video. She did not think I should be upset with Kenzo, nor should I yell at him. In the end, she accepts my apology. Lol."

[inavalan]

Hi theportalishere, welcome to the forum!

My thought is that Seth means last reincarnation anywhere. He's mentioned that while we incarnate in this physical existence, we also have counterparts in other "systems," so by the time of our last incarnation, we have had a chance to explore, have accomplished and learned what we intended to, our entity has expanded to it's satisfaction and we are ready to graduate.

"Far be it from me to give either Ruburt or yourself swelled heads, but in your cases we see the male and female aspects well-balanced, one of the reasons why this is your last incarnation. These elements are highly unstable and each personality works them out."
—TES9 Session 441 October 9, 1968

Seth did say that some of the graduates may choose to come back in special instances, such as a teaching opportunity, and it's purely their choice.

You may want to take a look at this, lots of good info here: https://findingseth.com/q/session:547+teachers+reincarnation/

Or take a vacation as a tree ...

[inavalan]

Session 108: "A personality reincarnates into different form, you have the retention of the original personality, intact, with its memories in the subconscious; and you have the additional formation of a completely new personality time after time. There is a splitting away from the original psychic branch, but with memory of previous individual existence. (...)

The individuals continue to exist, and express themselves according to their development in other fields not connected with yours, when they are finished on your plane. No particular identity is ever lost. If so the whole process would be meaningless. And in other ways to lesser degrees, through abstract thought, through art of any kind, the physical human being, having been formed by consciousness, in his own way then working through and with matter, constructs other fields or planes of attraction, which according to their abilities expand. This is not difficult to understand when you consider the relative difficulty in understanding even the simplest of physical phenomena alone."


Session 32:

"In the present personality we have abilities developed in past lives, and ability to paint for example that should be made more use of now. What you call Ruburt's sales ability is also a result of past experiences, and certain other latent abilities such as a facility with growing plants. He was at one time an excellent farmer. There has been here a willingness to experience, to experiment and to give as well as a ferocious capacity to take in. The trouble in the past has been a lack of discretion and self-discipline. He was always a pleasure loving personality however and avoided anything unpleasant.

His early circumstances in this life were chosen by him as a needed experience. In other lives he was able to exist without too much adversity and this time he chose troublesome and truly tragic circumstances as a needed challenge. His temper when aroused was very great however and he retaliated instantly. He had never known hatred however. This time he has had to deal with it in a most intimate manner. The old stormy temper is now seen in Ruburt's deep grudges. The personality of Ruburt's mother was not close to him in any other life. The circumstances of birth were chosen at the last minute on his part and was made for two reasons. One, the personality of the mother offered needed experience for Ruburt; and two, the paganistic personality of the father was in some degree like his own past personalities though in a much more vague and watered down way. A miscarriage later on the part of Ruburt's mother represented an entity who changed his mind so to speak. He was at one time a brother. Ruburt's present shape is something he has been working for. He was often tall, hardy and stout. (...)

This time you are both on your last reincarnation cycle on your plane, and as a rule no personality fragments are left behind. ("What would happen if we did have a child?") This happens fairly often. It does not change the fact that it is the last reincarnation cycle for parents for example, although it may be lonely for the child in such an instance. I have not gone into these questions; however, to some degree in the subconscious mind you have what could be called a ghost image of your ancestors, and when your parents are in their last reincarnation cycle they leave your plane and it is more difficult for the ghost image to be imprinted. What you would call the wisdom of instinct is not then so sure.

There have been however a few periods in mankind's history when this happened en masse. It just worked out that way that a large majority of personalities finished their cycles more or less at one time. ("When was the last time this happened?") The Middle Ages represented such a break, and I also suggest a break. (...)

When the Middle Ages began a large number of personalities who had lived before and during the Roman period were ready to end their reincarnation cycles. There were the most efficient learners, the wisest and most able personalities, and they withdrew their subconscious knowledge and memories from your plane. This was one of the reasons for the decay of knowledge and learning in the Middle Ages. There were personalities reincarnated during the Middle Ages who had lived during the Roman experience, however they were not leading personalities and they were not able to transmit knowledge or abilities from past lives, simply because they had not the inherent strength or capability needed.

There were other personalities of course who were fairly developed but these were resting. The world so to speak got back on its feet when these personalities reappeared centuries later; and by this time new personalities who had taken the place of those whose cycles were completed also began to use and show their abilities. ("In what century did the withdrawal take place?") By the end of the 10th century the first group of personalities completed their cycle. It took the period of time from then until the late 1600's for any valid readjustment to take place, and by the middle 17th century you began to get bursts of beneficial activities and new thrusts of knowledge. The monks who copied old manuscripts and preserved some remnants of knowledge did so because of their own past personal connection and experience with the knowledge itself. ("Were the French and American revolutions related to such a burst?") The revolutions, both of them, were so connected, representing an offshoot from the freedoms initiated in Athens and greatly expanded. Great Britain was in many respects a special place in that many of those personalities who had been resting were born there at fairly regular intervals, and you had a more consistent belief in liberty that did not necessitate such bloody and unfortunate revolutions as those that occurred elsewhere.

("What's the case in Russia today?") Today? ("Well, in this century then.") It is in many ways the fault of personalities themselves as to which lands are developed or underdeveloped in various ways. Many personalities prefer rebirth in pleasant temperate or warm climates. Often they congregate for such selfish reasons in pleasant climates and in countries where political situations are not dangerous. This has been the case with the country of Russia in the past but it may not be the case in the future; as activity grows there intellectual and psychic attractions will draw stronger and wiser personalities. The same in a somewhat different manner will apply to countries in Africa.
 
There are whole areas of material here that we have not discussed so that this is spotty, but we will go into it more deeply. There are no laws to force personalities to use all their abilities. A personality will not choose unfavorable circumstances of rebirth until he himself sees that necessary discipline can be achieved in no other manner. Therefore extremely hot and extremely cold countries go largely undeveloped. But once development begins to occur it is swift. The problems that a country must work out merely represent the problems set by the personality inhabitants for themselves, and the country is merely the framework of such activities.

There is a close bond between reincarnational cycles and earthly historical periods that we will discuss later. Sometimes though not always personalities who need a certain experience will be born into a particular country or race. I have been somewhat avoiding this whole issue since delicate balances are interconnected (...)
------------------------

From the above I understand that there is a close bond between reincarnational cycles and earthly historical periods. I also understand that a reincarnation is a completely new personality, time after time.

Great quote! All of it. Thanks.

[inavalan]

its in Seth Speaks:


"SS Chapter 2: Session 514, February 9, 1970

To this extent we indulge in relaxation and sleep, for we can spend a century as a tree or as an uncomplicated life form in another reality. We delight our consciousness with the enjoyment of simple existence. We may create, you see, the forest in which we grow. Usually however we are highly active, our full energies focused in our work and in new challenges."

Yep!  Yep!