~Speaking of Seth~

When we look around the world, we can see some powerful people doing nasty things. According to the Seth view of karma, these people can continue on their merry way without suffering consequences. It seems to me that the Law of One teachings are more realistic.

It's hard to say whether Seth gave a sanitized version of reality, he was instead accurate, or whether he was somewhat limited in the amount of information he could convey, considering the skills of Jane as a channeler, her vocabulary, and our ability to understand. I'm sure the materials that were given to humans by Speakers thousands of years ago would much more limited than what Seth, Jane and Rob accomplished. Seth didn't seem to hold much back, so I don't know why he would do that.

I'd like to hear more about your impressions or information from the Law of One teachings as you go through them. As you're so familiar with Seth, the differences will stand out to you.

Law of One has come up many times here, a search turned up 26 topics, this one included, so there are those that feel it's noteworthy. I looked at the website in the past and some of the info, but didn't very deeply into it. If you care to share more, please do so.

Deb, I searched just now for "Law of One", and only this thread showed up.

Maybe you searched from the search box on this page? You need to search from the Home page if you want the search engine to search the entire forum. Another limitation of this software. And you'll need to put it in quotes so "law of one" is treated as a phrase.

Deb, thanks for the tip about searching on th home page!! Many results turned up, of which the relevant ones are:

https://speakingofseth.com/index.php?topic=612.msg5173#msg5173

https://speakingofseth.com/index.php?topic=1208.msg9977#msg9977

https://speakingofseth.com/index.php?topic=1288.msg10450#msg10450

Hi Sena, I'm glad the search engine tip worked for you. Thanks for the links!

I listened to about half an hour of Carla's interview. I did find it interesting, and will listen to the rest. Carla is a very calming person and I'm enjoying what she had to say, she makes sense. Also watched the video about the L&L center.

I was curious of there were recordings of Carla channeling, and sure enough there are. The website is very thorough and loaded with links to free downloads. I also downloaded the first half of the channeled material book, "The Ra Contact," out of curiosity. Almost 600 pages, and it's only 56 sessons!

Here's a link to the first channeled session audio. After a few minutes I found her distracting, but I have the book now. At first I'd listened to a little of the second session, and the language was very confusing:

"However, if it be your desire to share our communications with others, we have the distortion towards a perception that this would be most helpful in regularizing and crystallizing your own patterns of vibration upon the levels of experience which you call the life. If one is illuminated, are not all illuminated? Therefore, we are oriented towards speaking for you in whatever supply of speakingness you may desire. To teach/learn is the Law of One in one of its most elementary distortions." I may need a translator.

Quote from: Deb
I'd like to hear more about your impressions or information from the Law of One teachings as you go through them. As you're so familiar with Seth, the differences will stand out to you.

Deb, I don't feel it would be right at this time to give a brief summary as it were of the main points of the Law of One teachings. What I find is that it is large body of knowledge, some of it difficult to understand, which seems to make sense as a whole. As ALL the books are available free of charge (for the ebooks) on the Law of One website, I recommend that anyone who has the time to spare may want to make use of that resource. My general impression is that these teachings are compatible with the Seth teachings, but go further.

Quote from: Sena

Quote from: Deb
I'd like to hear more about your impressions or information from the Law of One teachings as you go through them. As you're so familiar with Seth, the differences will stand out to you.

Deb, I don't feel it would be right at this time to give a brief summary as it were of the main points of the Law of One teachings. What I find is that it is large body of knowledge, some of it difficult to understand, which seems to make sense as a whole. As ALL the books are available free of charge (for the ebooks) on the Law of One website, I recommend that anyone who has the time to spare may want to make use of that resource. My general impression is that these teachings are compatible with the Seth teachings, but go further.

Hi, the Ra material is complicated. Any of these transmissions is more or less complicated and necessarily subject to distortions. There is another source, Aaron, a former Buddhist monk. As far as I know, he did an interview with Ra from the other side. To be clear: an interview conducted 'on the other side' among two non-incarnate entities. Aaron's style is very precise and clear. It may be worth going for that interview first, before investing much time in deciphering medieval concepts, which in the end may or may not be helpful. 'Deciphering' means you have to familiarize yourself with specific terminology, which may even change over the course of time. As far as I remember, Aaron and Ra had differing views on specific issues regarding the cosmos and creation. That being the rationale behind the 'interview'.

Check out the Deep Spring Center (om@deepspring.org)

Quote from: Tob
Check out the Deep Spring Center

Tob, thanks for that reference, but when I try to access https://www.deepspring.org/, I get Error 1016.

P.S. I was able to download "The Aaron/Q'uo Dialogues" by Barbara Brodsky and Carla L. Ruecker. Carla L. Rueckert, as you know is involved with the Law of One, so there is an overlap.

A quote from that book:

"We returned to Kentucky a year later; again, autumn colors embellished the landscape. This
was our largest group to date. Some were sleeping in the house; a few were housed in local hotel
rooms. Many people came from Michigan, but some came from as far away as Toronto. Many of
this group were aware that they are wanderers, and had come to explore this topic.
Wanderers are mentioned often in the Confederation channeling. Wanderers are those who
have chosen to incarnate on Earth from elsewhere in the universe in order to help lighten the
consciousness of Planet Earth at this time—the dawning of the fourth density. Thus, they come to
do service. And they incarnate because it is the only way that they can enter into the harvest 55 at the
end of third density, in order to graduate into fourth density, in a personal way. According to the
Confederation channelings, there are millions of wanderers here, and they have in common the
feeling of loneliness and isolation because the vibration in third density is different from what they
remember of their home density. It is at gatherings like this one that wanderers often feel "at home"
for the first time as they meet others of like mind."

The concept of the wanderer is clearly described in the Law of One material, and I find it rather fascinating.

Quote from: Sena
when I try to access https://www.deepspring.org/, I get Error 1016.

Sena, I was able to access the website with no problem. Internet says it could be related to "Cloudflare in your control panel." I'd not heard of Cloudflare, but it's an internet security program that may be installed on your device, or maybe your internet service provider uses it. The software may have noticed a discrepancy in the DNS settings for the domain name. If it's software you're using on your personal devices, you can try to make an adjustment on your ipad or computer through the control panel. If not, it's something Deep Spring's web developer needs to fix on their end.

Tob, thanks also for the link.

Quote from: Deb

Quote from: Sena
when I try to access https://www.deepspring.org/, I get Error 1016.

Sena, I was able to access the website with no problem. Internet says it could be related to "Cloudflare in your control panel." I'd not heard of Cloudflare, but it's an internet security program that may be installed on your device, or maybe your internet service provider uses it. The software may have noticed a discrepancy in the DNS settings for the domain name. If it's software you're using on your personal devices, you can try to make an adjustment on your ipad or computer through the control panel. If not, it's something Deep Spring's web developer needs to fix on their end.

Tob, thanks also for the link.

Here is the link to the archive:

https://archives.deepspring.org/

I just got it from the internet, i.e: from outside a minute ago.

The interview must have been conducted a few years ago. I remember it was initially announced as a book project. In the end it was an interview. I think I have seen it. Must have been 7 or 10 years back

You can also subscribe to daily Aaron quotes. Encouraging

Quote from: Deb
Internet says it could be related to "Cloudflare in your control panel." I'd not heard of Cloudflare, but it's an internet security program that may be installed on your device, or maybe your internet service provider uses it.

Deb, thanks for that info. I use Sky Broadband in the UK, and that may be the culprit:

"An unknown number of websites who use the popular CloudFlare Content Delivery Network (CDN) are finding that UK customers of Sky Broadband cannot view their content because one or more of the IP addresses that Sky blocks as part of their court ordered anti-piracy censorship tool includes an IP that's shared with the CDN."

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2015/04/uk-isp-sky-broadband-inadvertently-blocks-innocent-websites-again.html

Now that I have downloaded the book mentioned in my postscript, it is not imperative that I access the website.

Quote from: Tob
Here is the link to the archive:

https://archives.deepspring.org/

Tob, thanks for the link. That works fine.

this is by the way Aaron's quote for today:

'Thought for Today

As much as is possible, it's helpful to grow your own food, or participate in a community farm where you know the food is grown and harvested with gratitude and mindfulness. If you can't do that, if you must buy that stalk of broccoli or piece of chicken that has a low vibrational frequency, spend a few minutes with it before you prepare it. Apologize to it for the brutality which it has met. Although you are not personally responsible for that brutality, you're part of that food chain and thereby do have responsibility. Offer it your deepest appreciation. Literally draw light into it. This is the smudged glass that is essentially pure. It's not that the vibrational frequency is low so much as the high vibrational frequency is dimmed by the tension and distortion within the food. Your gratitude, your prayer, can help remove the smudges and help bring forth the higher vibrational frequency, can make it accessible. Always eat your food with gratitude. So choose as wisely as you can, and then cook with love and eat with love.'

Quote from: Sena
When we look around the world, we can see some powerful people doing nasty things. According to the Seth view of karma, these people can continue on their merry way without suffering consequences. It seems to me that the Law of One teachings are more realistic.

hi sena,

i didn't know anything about law of one so i looked up a kind of synopsis of it. unfortunately, i didn't really get anything specific about why the law of one might indicate that people will necessarily suffer consequences for their actions.

for me at least, i don't feel like seth gave a sanitized version of spiritual reality. or... i'm thinking i guess of it all as reality. spiritual and physical. kind of this whole ball of wax.

i don't know, i kind of look at what seth says in a very simplistic way. for me everything i've read seems like our choosing to come here is like choosing a video game to play. at least this is my interpretation.

by choosing the game (shoot 'em up vs find the jewels, or this earth physical world vs a universe in which you explore and live in a single moment) and our avatar (which results from choosing our parents - era/location/economic conditions) we know going in a bit about what the game is going to be like. but in the game - we can do anything we like. and like in a video game there are really no consequences to the player for anything that they do, except here on earth death stops it. then you get to play again if you'd like. and maybe the more you play, the more you learn. as seth says, this earth life is about learning to manipulate energy in order to create. hopefully we learn to do it to create the reality that we want.

i don't like what a lot of people do out there. i can get angry about them (and i have, a hell of a lot), but once i let go of what they do (in my immediate space they don't affect me, like seth's 'i live in a safe universe') i got rid of a a good chunk of stress.

and the way i've come to think of the real jackasses out there, throughout time, is that in one way they may have offered to come in to play the villain. i think seth talked about that, right? and we all agree (by choosing the era and country/city/community/parents we come in through) kind of what we're putting ourselves in front of. to learn what we (as beings) came here to learn. or perhaps how to manipulate energy and create our reality under different and differing conditions.

so my feeling is that it's not sanitized... it's just a kind of free for all. that hopefully, we learn quicker than maybe we did the last time - how to create our reality so that jackasses don't touch us, or don't even matter.

Quote from: michaelk
i didn't know anything about law of one so i looked up a kind of synopsis of it. unfortunately, i didn't really get anything specific about why the law of one might indicate that people will necessarily suffer consequences for their actions.

Michael, thanks for your comments. In the Law of One there are a number of statements on karma, but the one I find interesting is this:

QuoteNegatively oriented entities need to be 95% intending to be of service to self, seeing other selves as those which shall be manipulated and controlled, gathering their energy for their own use. The negatively oriented entity sees the universe as that place which shall be put in order. Power is that which aids evolution. Those which are more strong and more powerful will dominate those that are less powerful.

The positively oriented entity sees all other entities as the Creator and attempts to be of service to them. If he is successful 51% of the time, he is then available for graduation into the fourth density. All of our experiences that we gain here in the third density are for the purpose of making this choice.

https://www.llresearch.org/speeches/speech_1994_0000.aspx

How I understand this is that if one focuses on Service to Others (STO) at least 51% of the time as opposed to Service to Self (STS), then one will be eligible for graduation to fourth density. Otherwise, one will need to reincarnate in third density (where we are now).

Another quote from the same page:

QuoteIf we can find love in as many experiences as possible in an illusion which appears at times to be quite negative, the decisions and choices we make for that love in serving others carry a great deal more weight in our total beingness than if we make such choices with a complete assuredness that all is indeed One.

So, Ra suggested that at the end of this 75,000-year cycle there is a graduation or a harvest. There are three possibilities for that graduation. If entities are polarized in the positive sense—as I said, to a 51% degree—then they move on to a positively polarized fourth-density planet and form what Ra called a social memory complex.

A free ebook which covers this topic can be downloaded here:

https://www.llresearch.org/library/living_the_law_of_one_the_choice/living_the_law_of_one_the_choice.pdf

A quote from that book:

QuoteIn making this Choice, and in continuing to choose lovingly, we
are not only creating an acceleration of the pace of our spiritual
evolution. We are also preparing ourselves for the Graduation Day
that will come when you die a natural death.
Would you rather graduate, at the end of this lifetime, and move
on to the Density of Love? Or would you rather spend 76,000 or
so more years having one incarnation after another in another
earth-like environment while working with these same lessons and
playing this same game? Most of us would choose to graduate.

The key to graduating is to achieve sufficient polarity to move on.
Let's put this in numbers. According to the Ra group, graduation
in positive polarity is achieved when we have a score of 51%
service to others or higher. In other words, if we are thinking about
serving others more than half of the time, we have made a score
that allows graduation in positive polarity.

thanks so much, Sena, for all the quotes. now i see what you're talking about.

maybe i'm not remembering correctly, but i thought seth said that karma didn't really operate? at least in his view. maybe you remember differently? or maybe others can offer any thoughts?

if that is the case then seth and Ra's way of looking at things are just two different ways?

Quote from: michaelk

if that is the case then seth and Ra's way of looking at things are just two different ways?

i'm quoting myself here, which is just plain weird... hahahahaha

okay what i realized, Sena, is that yes you are already saying they're two different ways. i'm a little slow here.

but i think then it's just a matter of which way each of us believes the world operates. it seems like you believe karma operates, like Ra?

Quote from: michaelk
but i think then it's just a matter of which way each of us believes the world operates. it seems like you believe karma operates, like Ra?

Michael, it seems to me that the Ra view of karma is closer to the truth than the Seth view. Seth criticizes the Buddhist view of karma which sees karma as punishment for sins in a past life. Many years ago, my wife was diagnosed with a serious blood disorder. Buddhist friends of ours seemed to a bit shocked by this. Although they were too polite to say it, I had the feeling that they were shocked because according to their version of Buddhism, the disease may be punishment for sins in a past life. Seth criticizes that view, and I agree with Seth.

I am sure Ra would have agreed with Seth that karma is not punishment, but Ra is clearer than Seth in pointing out that selfish behavior does have consequences.

Quote from: michaelk
thanks so much, Sena, for all the quotes. now i see what you're talking about.

maybe i'm not remembering correctly, but i thought seth said that karma didn't really operate? at least in his view. maybe you remember differently? or maybe others can offer any thoughts?

if that is the case then seth and Ra's way of looking at things are just two different ways?

"Now karma does not operate in terms of cause and effect though it seems to you that it must. Instead, you see, all your acts now affect all of your other reincarnational selves both, in your terms, past and present. Now you have settled upon one mathematical system to follow in your universe. Along with it you have settled upon one line of reality. This you endorse as reality, and anything outside of it does not have your stamp of approval, so therefore, it seems to you that it cannot exist, in your terms."
—TECS3 ESP Class Session, May 4, 1971

This is the first hit you get when you search for 'Karma' at 'finding Seth", the search engine.

He did explain the relationship between the various incarnations in 'Unknown Reality', using the different islands as analogy. There are constant interactions between the 'islands'. Nothing is fixed. Applied to the biographies of different individuals it means, the sorrows of a man who is in a complicated relationship with a wife and a girlfriend at the same time, does affect the soccer player in another incarnation. The soccer player, a few meters away from the goal, however,  does not give up and can achieve a success in the game and - thus - suddenly the person concerned about the complicated relationship has the impression he found a good solution how to proceed with his family situation.

All these interactions are interrelated, and all occur at the same time, i.e: NOW. Because there is only now. Actually, there is only 'here and now'. And because there is only 'here and now', there is neither time nor space, no 'fixed' history, and no Karma.

One should not try to replace Western concepts, deliberately designed to keep us guilty, such as 'original sin' by something which is not less problematic: Karma. There is no Karma, according to Seth. And there is no reincarnation either in the strict sense, according to Seth. All incarnations are being lived NOW, by another part of the same entity, which is the greater YOU that you are, i.e. the oversoul in Jane Robert's terminology.

In the example given by Seth, it means in general, when approaching things and issues with a (more) positive attitude, you are automatically 'improving' the lives of all your other 'Selves' as well, i.e. the other incarnations. It is thus the accumulated sum of all your other incarnations which does play a more 'constructive' part in creation if just a single one, a single person, and maybe just for a few minutes, out of the overall number of individuated Selves changes from a pessimistic to a more optimistic attitude, e.g. by simply saying
'everything will be fine' (Seth, 'Unknown Reality').

All experiences thus generated ARE creation and the very reason for us 'being here'. What matters in the end are the experiences, nothing else. It is the entire bandwidth of experiences which matters in creation. If we improve the incarnations of our fellow 'Selves', by thinking positively ourselves, even if just for a few minutes, this does have a constructive effect on the entirety of creation via all our other existences. This is basically what Seth is saying with the island analogy. This does of course not mean that negativity does no longer exist. It is just not part of our 'corner of the universe' anymore, even if just for a moment. 'Negativity' per se is part of creation. It is the counterpart, the driving force.

According to Seth, violence is never justified. Having sent armies to the North (when he was a pope) this is a bit a strange statement given to the ones who are on this side at the moment, having to deal with violence, including structural violence. According to him we are creating the violence in the first place (via creating a universe where violence does exist) and it would be up to us to find non-violent solutions. But according to him some persons do incarnate with the clear objective of polarising, thus triggering new developments. To me a bit of a contradiction. Seth is clearly in favor of signalling 'red lines' by what he calls 'natural aggression', thus defusing situations - by showing the red lines - which could otherwise lead to the eruption of physical violence. However, he does not say anything about non-physical violence, e.g. structural violence which makes it problematic.

According to both, Seth and Bashar, there is a live review. According to Seth we have the option to experience some episodes of our life again in order to better understand specific developments and the outcomes. We have also the option to 'change the outcome', if we wish. According to Bashar the live review is the phase where we are confronted with the effects and implications our activities had on other lives. But everybody is 'free to accept the results of the live review, or not'. According to Bashar 'everybody goes to heaven'. He says that we actually never left. The largest part of our soul is (still) there.

According to Seth creation is nested. We live lives which we sometimes may perceive as one-sided, thus playing out characteristics which our ouversoul is 'in need of' for balancing out its own energies. Thus I think we should not operate so much with categories of 'good' and 'bad'. 'Karma' is definitely not better than the concept of the 'original sin', just because it comes with Eastern mythologies.

According to Seth we are 'here' to learn that we are creating our reality with our thoughts, emotions and belief systems. There is a time lag between a thought and the manifestation of the respective reality. This time lag is protecting us. Only when we have learned that it is us who is creating our environment and that we are doing that with our thoughts, our feelings, and our beliefs, only then are we ready to terminate the 'cycle of reincarnations' and proceed to other 'reality production systems' where the materialization is instant. At the moment that would be too dangeous for us (Seth).

In all the near death experience research, one of the common accounts is a life review in which one experiences the positive and negative emotions that others have felt as a result of the NDEr's  actions in physical life. This could be a form of hell, depending on how he/she has conducted his/her life, though it is over "quickly" (if it can be described that way, as it is described as happening in a timeless manner). It is not characterized as punishment.

In past-life regressions, it is common for someone to find the source of a physical condition as being related to a past life, though not as punishment. The subject may get in touch with having made an agreement to have a condition in order to have a certain kind of learning experience (or to provide one for someone else). Another example might be having a birthmark or physical condition that is related to how one died in a past life. That does not seem to fit the idea of karma as punishment, though it may be a kind of karma in the sense of needing to complete an experience for the lessons it may provide.

However one views the so-called negative experiences of our lives, I believe that they are taken on by choice, either during our physical lives or by agreement between lives. So karma in my view is what we voluntarily take on when we see a need for a learning experience.

first off this is a great discussion.

Quote from: Tob
"Now karma does not operate in terms of cause and effect though it seems to you that it must. Instead, you see, all your acts now affect all of your other reincarnational selves both, in your terms, past and present. Now you have settled upon one mathematical system to follow in your universe. Along with it you have settled upon one line of reality. This you endorse as reality, and anything outside of it does not have your stamp of approval, so therefore, it seems to you that it cannot exist, in your terms."
—TECS3 ESP Class Session, May 4, 1971

This is the first hit you get when you search for 'Karma' at 'finding Seth", the search engine.

He did explain the relationship between the various incarnations in 'Unknown Reality', using the different islands as analogy. There are constant interactions between the 'islands'. Nothing is fixed. Applied to the biographies of different individuals it means, the sorrows of a man who is in a complicated relationship with a wife and a girlfriend at the same time, does affect the soccer player in another incarnation. The soccer player, a few meters away from the goal, however,  does not give up and can achieve a success in the game and - thus - suddenly the person concerned about the complicated relationship has the impression he found a good solution how to proceed with his family situation.

All these interactions are interrelated, and all occur at the same time, i.e: NOW. Because there is only now. Actually, there is only 'here and now'. And because there is only 'here and now', there is neither time nor space, no 'fixed' history, and no Karma.

One should not try to replace Western concepts, deliberately designed to keep us guilty, such as 'original sin' by something which is not less problematic: Karma. There is no Karma, according to Seth. And there is no reincarnation either in the strict sense, according to Seth. All incarnations are being lived NOW, by another part of the same entity, which is the greater YOU that you are, i.e. the oversoul in Jane Robert's terminology.

In the example given by Seth, it means in general, when approaching things and issues with a (more) positive attitude, you are automatically 'improving' the lives of all your other 'Selves' as well, i.e. the other incarnations. It is thus the accumulated sum of all your other incarnations which does play a more 'constructive' part in creation if just a single one, a single person, and maybe just for a few minutes, out of the overall number of individuated Selves changes from a pessimistic to a more optimistic attitude, e.g. by simply saying
'everything will be fine' (Seth, 'Unknown Reality').

All experiences thus generated ARE creation and the very reason for us 'being here'. What matters in the end are the experiences, nothing else. It is the entire bandwidth of experiences which matters in creation. If we improve the incarnations of our fellow 'Selves', by thinking positively ourselves, even if just for a few minutes, this does have a constructive effect on the entirety of creation via all our other existences. This is basically what Seth is saying with the island analogy. This does of course not mean that negativity does no longer exist. It is just not part of our 'corner of the universe' anymore, even if just for a moment. 'Negativity' per se is part of creation. It is the counterpart, the driving force.

According to Seth, violence is never justified. Having sent armies to the North (when he was a pope) this is a bit a strange statement given to the ones who are on this side at the moment, having to deal with violence, including structural violence. According to him we are creating the violence in the first place (via creating a universe where violence does exist) and it would be up to us to find non-violent solutions. But according to him some persons do incarnate with the clear objective of polarising, thus triggering new developments. To me a bit of a contradiction. Seth is clearly in favor of signalling 'red lines' by what he calls 'natural aggression', thus defusing situations - by showing the red lines - which could otherwise lead to the eruption of physical violence. However, he does not say anything about non-physical violence, e.g. structural violence which makes it problematic.

According to both, Seth and Bashar, there is a live review. According to Seth we have the option to experience some episodes of our life again in order to better understand specific developments and the outcomes. We have also the option to 'change the outcome', if we wish. According to Bashar the live review is the phase where we are confronted with the effects and implications our activities had on other lives. But everybody is 'free to accept the results of the live review, or not'. According to Bashar 'everybody goes to heaven'. He says that we actually never left. The largest part of our soul is (still) there.

Sena, i agree with everything you've written here. it's the same as my understanding of the seth material, and what i operate from.

Quote from: Tob
Thus I think we should not operate so much with categories of 'good' and 'bad'. 'Karma' is definitely not better than the concept of the 'original sin', just because it comes with Eastern mythologies.

and i absolutely agree with this.

as for karma, i'm not a person who believes in karma, but from your original post i thought you did. and if you don't that was my misunderstanding.

Quote from: Sena
According to the Seth view of karma, these people can continue on their merry way without suffering consequences. It seems to me that the Law of One teachings are more realistic.

or maybe you were talking about consequences (for actions) more, rather than karma?

but as you nicely summarized above, the consequences those people face are internal/for themselves. the 'merry way' you mention may refer to their particular physical life, getting away with something there?

or - am i getting the point you were making in your original post wrong?

Quote from: Sena
Wanderers are those who
have chosen to incarnate on Earth from elsewhere in the universe in order to help lighten the
consciousness of Planet Earth at this time—the dawning of the fourth density.

Thanks for sharing this Sena; yes, this is intriguing.  I'm not sure I know someone who clearly fits this description.  The people I know are all actively wrestling with the challenges presented by their psyches.  We have moments of laughter, but life is experienced as weighty.

Well, I do have a decades-old memory of being out walking with my son, who was a small child at the time.  We were walking next to a cyclone fence surrounding a park, and were involved in some kind of serious discussion.  He was a serious child.  Having serious discussions was what we did.   An older gentleman walked by us, who was running his fingers along the cyclone fence, enjoying that weird vibrating sensation in the arm.  He looked back at us with the most light and playful grin, and I could feel myself immediately lighten in his presence.  He was buoyant!  He made intentful eye contact with both of us, and that eye contact did not feel ordinary.  I actually wondered at the time if he was an incarnated angel or something, even though I didn't believe in angels.  Every now and then I think of him and wonder, still.

Quote from: Sena
Would you rather graduate, at the end of this lifetime, and move
on to the Density of Love? Or would you rather spend 76,000 or
so more years having one incarnation after another in another
earth-like environment while working with these same lessons and
playing this same game?

This statement feels like a red flag to me about this teacher, because it is fear-inducing.  The teachers that ring the truest to me never motivate with fear, ever.  Love and peace emanate from every word they say.  I suppose I must be open to the possibility that threatening 76,000 years of more of the same works as an expression of love for certain people?  It just doesn't feel right.   

Quote from: leidl
This statement feels like a red flag to me about this teacher, because it is fear-inducing.

leidl, thanks for sharing your feelings. I have to say it did not induce fear in me. I saw it as just a reminder to me to focus a bit more on Service to Others.

QuoteWell, I do have a decades-old memory of being out walking with my son, who was a small child at the time.  We were walking next to a cyclone fence surrounding a park, and were involved in some kind of serious discussion.  He was a serious child.  Having serious discussions was what we did.   An older gentleman walked by us, who was running his fingers along the cyclone fence, enjoying that weird vibrating sensation in the arm.  He looked back at us with the most light and playful grin, and I could feel myself immediately lighten in his presence.  He was buoyant!  He made intentful eye contact with both of us, and that eye contact did not feel ordinary.  I actually wondered at the time if he was an incarnated angel or something, even though I didn't believe in angels.

What an interesting story. May be the gentleman was super-human!

The fact that someone's playful smile could stay with me for decades suggests it was not an ordinary encounter to me.  It also stands as a beautiful example of what an act of service can look like.  Eye contact that touches the inner self is enough.  :-)

I do like listening to the Ra stuff especially the fast robot voice monologues you can find on YouTube.

I think it goes like this. As in Sena's quote 51% of your time helping others next incarnation you get to incarnate in 4th density positive, 95% of your time spent just doing stuff to please you means you get to incarnate in 4th density negative. The important thing to remember in terms of karma is 4th density negative is a hell hole. It's societies are always based on master/slave structure. There is a constant battle to get up the food chain. For me this is karma in action - though I don't think this is classic karma which I believe is more a sense of guilt, which the negatively polarised do not experience. I think a lot people who end up here are going to quickly polarise to 4th density positive just to get out - I mean can you imagine being on a planet entirely populated by selfish asshls. I know one or two seriously selfish people, they are not nasty or evil per se, mostly they are just lazy. And so by accident almost they may earn themselves a place in 4th density negative - I find this quite scary.

I was thinking about the reincarnation process, how we pick tasks and challenges and I was wondering what happens if you just said no thanks - I'm going to do my own thing and not give myself challenges I'm just going to have an easy time as possible when I incarnate. So do these entities end up in 4 density negative - I think it's possible that this is one major route.


There are few 5th density negative entities and if these do reach 6th in negative polarity they polarise quickly to positive, like instantly.  They can go no further.

The fact that the negatively polarised aka what we would call evil entities get  up the ladder at all is difficult for us to comprehend I think. The key here is that although 4th density positive entities can endure the greater strength of love/light energy at this level because of their love and compassion for others, the negative can also endure at a higher intensity of love/light because they love themselves so much.

This quote from Ra 'Thus one who has set in motion an action may forgive itself and never again make that error. This also brakes or stops what you call karma'

I think Ra is talking here for those positively polarising. The negatives will not incur karma because they don't have to forgive themselves. But still karma in a sense is experienced because most cannot endure the brutality of 4th density negative.

Is Seth's version is sanitised? Possibly it is. He does not want morality messing up his message. Another question was asked somewhere about the 'why' missing from Seth's work, same reason, it brings in morality which us humans have a habit of using against each other.

Quote from: Bora137
I think Ra is talking here for those positively polarising. The negatives will not incur karma because they don't have to forgive themselves. But still karma in a sense is experienced because most cannot endure the brutality of 4th density negative.

Is Seth's version is sanitised? Possibly it is. He does not want morality messing up his message. Another question was asked somewhere about the 'why' missing from Seth's work, same reason, it brings in morality which us humans have a habit of using against each other.

Bora, thanks for your thoughtful post. I hope I am not getting into politics here, but as an example of the negatively polarized I shall take the Taliban. If Taliban members decide that a woman is improperly dressed, they may cause her physical injury. This is because they believe that their "God" will reward them in the afterlife for causing injury to the woman. We see this as a false belief, but the Taliban don't see it that way.

Does it mean that "negative polarization" is due to false beliefs? Seth would see it that way, but the Law of One according to Ra does not seem to have that insight.

This is Seth on beliefs:

"You are in physical existence to learn and understand that your energy, translated into feelings, thoughts and emotions, causes all experience. There are no exceptions. Once you understand this you have only to learn to examine the nature of your beliefs, for these will automatically cause you to feel and think in certain fashions. Your emotions follow your beliefs. It is not the other way around." (from "The Nature of Personal Reality: Specific, Practical Techniques for Solving Everyday Problems and Enriching the Life You Know, Session 614 (A Seth Book)" by Jane Roberts)

Kindle edition: https://amzn.eu/cr3sTIH

It would seem that Seth's teachings are more practical and nearer to the truth than those of Ra.

Quote from: Sena
If Taliban members decide that a woman is improperly dressed, they may cause her physical injury. This is because they believe that their "God" will reward them in the afterlife for causing injury to the woman. We see this as a false belief, but the Taliban don't see it that way.

It's things like this that makes it hard for me to believe The Shift (the way it's been represented by various new age prophets) is coming to this planet any time soon. Religious beliefs are very closely guarded.

Quote from: Deb

Quote from: Sena
If Taliban members decide that a woman is improperly dressed, they may cause her physical injury. This is because they believe that their "God" will reward them in the afterlife for causing injury to the woman. We see this as a false belief, but the Taliban don't see it that way.

It's things like this that makes it hard for me to believe The Shift (the way it's been represented by various new age prophets) is coming to this planet any time soon. Religious beliefs are very closely guarded. In Sethian terms, entities in Frameworks 2,3, and 4 could be having plans that we are not aware of.

Deb, I agree that all predictions are untrustworthy. The Law of One prediction, however, is that negatively polarized individuals (like the Taliban?) will be sent off to a negatively polarized planet. The human race on its own seems unable to deal with this problem. In Sethian terms, entities in Frameworks 2,3, and 4 could be having plans we are not aware of.

QuoteDoes it mean that "negative polarization" is due to false beliefs? Seth would see it that way, but the Law of One according to Ra does not seem to have that insight.

I don't think Ra and Seth are that far apart. The negative or dark path leads nowhere ultimately so it is a distortion and not true reality, I'm sure I have read something stating this in the Ra Material but I can't find it.  6th density is as far as the negatively polarised entity can go. This isn't because of some law it's just practically impossible to progress for them. They very very rarely become wanders incarnating on this plane (3rd density) because behind the veil they might accidentally stray off the negative path and lose polarisation and get trapped here, also there is little benefit for them coming here by that method. They might try to influence earth's polarisation by visiting 3th density earth in 4th or 5th density craft. Ra says a group of negatively oriented entities posed as the Christ god and gave Moses the Ten Commandments. Anyway they failed because earth has polarised positive albeit mixed so at harvest there will be a few negative entities progressing. Btw 10% of third density planets polarise negative according to Ra. I think the further out from the galactic core the more likely polarisation will be negative.

Yes I would say the Taliban are an example of a master slave structure. Though there will be members who are acting out of good motives even though highly deluded. And there will be genuinely good people who are Taliban, helping who they can even though they are part of a group that is highly negative. This is because the Taliban exists in 3rd density, the density of choosing so everything is a mixed bag. Most of them won't be fully polarised to the negative, most will change their ways through their incarnations. Put it this way even Hitler according to Ra was not negatively polarised. Only 10% of us choose the negative path Ra says and eventually all polarise positive.

I love positively polarised wanderers just because when judged by our values they appear to be the biggest 'losers'. Socially inept often, not good at obtaining material wealth, not popular. Generally looked down on by the majority of society but in fact they are 6th density super angels. I'm lucky enough to know two (I've worked this out from Ra's descriptions and asking my dowser/pendant). You might know one in your life if you do there is a high likelihood that they came here to help you. To their 6th density peers they are regarded as daredevils and insane risk takers because there is no guaranteed ticket back out of 3rd density once they are here, and who wants to get stuck here. If you do happen to find one treasure them. A good way to spot that someone might be a wanderer is that you think you are helping them then at some point you realise it's they that are helping you.

This is a little on track ..
I was looking through Seth material for negativity etc bc I just went through some hospitol "#&$@(" and using my toolbox to stay sane and not "@%#&$*)(/ " 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Anyway I think this is helpful but my whole body is tired from this last week so maybe not lol



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"Positive and negative thinking is more than a turn of phrase. Dimensions do indeed exist within this electrical field of which I have spoken, and it should be understood that I speak of an independent electrical field, and not of the weak, apparent electrical effects that can be observed within the brain or nervous system. The electrical reality of emotions and thoughts represents a thought dimension that has been completely neglected; and in it there are other dimensions; as within your field there is apparent space and time and height and thickness, so in the electrical system there is intensity and what I will call space reality, electrical mass and potentiality, which is different from intensity and polarity."
—TES3 Session 123 January 20, 1965

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Truthfully I do declare this last week .... with a loved one in hospitol and reading that above ... I am just ugh ugh ugh 🤣🤣🤣

Gonna do some Byron Katie worksheets tomorrow. For breakfast.

I peeked at the news earlier today just to scan the map of current mass reality and I .... scrolled headlines and thought...wtf am I doing LOL...so I said hellah nah...K BYE... that did not help my situation at all.
Lololololol

Pandora was lurking around the corner and I played whackamole!

Geeeeeezzzzz

Dimensions within dimensions 👀

"In my father's house are many mansions." 🤣🤣🤣

(We need a pom pom emoji lol)

Quote from: strangerthings
Dimensions within dimensions 👀

"In my father's house are many mansions." 🤣🤣🤣

St, you make an interesting connection between dimensions and mansions.

QuoteTruthfully I do declare this last week .... with a loved one in hospitol and reading that above ... I am just ugh ugh ugh 🤣🤣🤣

hope things improve this week Strangerthings

Quote from: Bora137

QuoteTruthfully I do declare this last week .... with a loved one in hospitol and reading that above ... I am just ugh ugh ugh 🤣🤣🤣

hope things improve this week Strangerthings

It most certainly has already!❤️
Weeeeeeeeeeeee

😅